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Mists of Pandaria: All Specs

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I finally did more testing of Echo of Elements. Wow Beta build is 15589. I used lvl 85 tauren Shaman. Testing specs were enhancement and restoration. That is important, because proc chance of this talent depends on your specialization. Damage spells were tested on lvl 85 Training Dummies (with one exception) and healing spells were tested mainly on myself and in one case on random afk hunter (lvl85)

I was wondering whether blizzard changed if certain spells can proc this talent and I found that Unleash Frost, Lightning Shield (static shock), Searing Bolt, Flametongue weapon proc and Frostbrand weapon proc can't be duplicated in enhancement spec. In restoration spec I couldn't duplicate Lava Burst, Unleash Flame and Unleash Life (didn't tried others), but that could by issue of very low proc chance. I don't know if its intentional or not, nevertheless it will be reported on the beta bug forum.

Now to the data. To determine proc chance I was using mainly Lightning Bolt (no cd, cheap, no dot), but proc chances of other spells were tested as well.

Enhancement spec:

Lightning Bolt: 76 procs out of 300 casts (25% proc chance)

Lava Burst: 24 procs out of 75 casts (32% proc chance) - lava burst now has 100% crit chance even without flame shock on target in enha spec (normal behaviour in resto spec). Great fun insta killing mobs in Twilight Highlands. Reported as a bug.

Chain Lightning: I tested this spell on one, two and three targets and results are at least interesting.

1 target: 9 procs out of 30 casts (30%)

2 targets: 22 procs (2 hits) out of 30 casts (73%) - note: only 2 available training dummies are lvl 80 dummies in Thunder Bluff.

3 targets: 17 procs (3 hits) out of 45 casts (38%) and 10 procs (2 hits only) out of 45 casts (22%) - 60% proc chance combined

Different proc chance on 2 targets and three targets might be result of small test sample, but it could indicate that proc chance depends on level of target. I need to do more tests on this.

Healing Surge: 6 procs out of 25 (24%)

Chain Heal: 9 procs out of 25 (36%) - only one torget.

Proc frequency of other tested spells was roughly same.

Restoration spec:

Lightning Bolt: 9 procs out of 100 (9%)

Greater Healing Wave: 7 procs out of 100 (7%) - partly tested on random afk hunter

Healing Surge: 9 procs out of 100 (9%)

There is significant difference in proc chance between two specializations. Enhancement echo of elements duplicates damage and healing spells roughly three times frequently than in restoration spec. I can't determine proc chance in elemental spec, because respecing is not implemented yet and elemental mastery also adds another dimension to this problem.

If you are interested in the raw data, you can find them here.

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A brief word on reporting proc rates. Simple procs (no ICD, no scaling of rate with haste via a PPM mechanic) are estimated by regular binomial variables (as an example, a fair coin is a binary variable with a p=0.5).

If you're reporting observed proc rates (\hat p) of X procs out of N observations, the observed proc rate is obviously (X / N). That part is easy. There's a lot of talk about how confident you are about those values (how big of an N do you need?)

If you're really interested, there's a decent writeup here.

The short story is, to have a 95% confidence that the actual proc rate is somewhere within your reported range of proc rates, you report \hat p \pm z_{1- \alpha /2} \sqrt{ \frac{\hat p \left ( 1- \hat p \right )}{n}}. In our case, z_{1- \alpha /2} for a 95% confidence is 1.96. So, for example, 76 procs out of 300 casts has an n of 300, a \hat p of 0.253. Therefore the 95% range of confidence is 0.253 \pm 1.96 \sqrt { \frac {0.253 * 0.747}{300} }. Therefore the proc rate is between 0.278 and 0.228. Probably 0.25, since programmers like multiples of five.

If you'd prefer a 99% confidence interval (meaning you can say that it's 99% likely that the ACTUAL proc rate is within your reported values), change the 1.96 to 2.58.

Naturally, if you can get 300+ observations, this isn't a big deal. But it helps get a handle on corner cases like when you're testing changing proc rates under some buff or another and it's difficult to get an N above 20.

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Thanks for that math pfooti. I take my data as preview of this talent so we have an idea how good it might be and how does it work. To get at least a bit accurate proc rate I need 1000+ casts as a sample.

Anyway I did another test. Whole testing was done in enhancement spec. I was interested if proc chance depends on target level. I used Lightning Bolt against lvl 85 training dummy and lvl 60 training dummy. I got 66 procs out of 200 casts in first case and 65 procs out of 200 casts in latter. I think that this theory can be rejected.

I also did more tests with Chain Lightning.

Against 1 target (lvl 85) I got 34 procs out of 100.

Against 2 targets (lvl 80) I got 48 procs out of 100.

Against 3 targets (lvl 85) I got 59 procs out of 100.

This finally shows that proc chance is increasing with number of targets (might be interesting to test with Glyph of Chain Lightning). I also found what those strange numbers of duplicated hits mean. When testing against 3+ targets I sometimes get +2 hits and sometimes +3. Whole problem was caused by position of training dummies in Orgrimmar. There are 4 dummies in row. I was targeting first one and sometimes proc hit 3rd one jumped to 4th and wasn't able to jump back to hit 2nd dummy.

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Well, if the proc rate is actually 0.35 and you have a additional 0.35 chance of proccing a dupe off of a proc, you'd expect to see an overall proc total of (0.35 + 0.35 ^ 2) * 100 = 47, so your two-jump number seems reasonable along those lines. Adding triple procs, you'd expect to see 60, so all those numbers seem to make sense. You're still getting an overall proc rate of 0.35, but the way the system counts (some double and triple procs), it makes the proc rate seem higher.

Note that those are total procs, meaning that you'd still only get 35% of your chain lightning casts to proc events, of which 35% are doubles and the remaining 65% are singles.

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Well, if the proc rate is actually 0.35 and you have a additional 0.35 chance of proccing a dupe off of a proc, you'd expect to see an overall proc total of (0.35 + 0.35 ^ 2) * 100 = 47, so your two-jump number seems reasonable along those lines. Adding triple procs, you'd expect to see 60, so all those numbers seem to make sense. You're still getting an overall proc rate of 0.35, but the way the system counts (some double and triple procs), it makes the proc rate seem higher.

Note that those are total procs, meaning that you'd still only get 35% of your chain lightning casts to proc events, of which 35% are doubles and the remaining 65% are singles.

Actually no. Number of procs I wrote is number of casts where duplication occured. Number of hits is always maximum possible. That means when attacking three targets with 100 Chain Lightnings I got 300 regular hits plus 177 (59*3) additional hits. As far as I know Echo of Elements duplicates whole spell.

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If CL Echo were to provide the same 35% chance to proc the whole spell per target, the expected proc chance would look like this:

[table]targets||chance for no Echo on cast||chance for Echo proc

1||0.65||35.0%

2||0.65^2||57.8%

3||0.65^3||72.5%

4||0.65^4||82.1%[/table]

This is not the behavior you're observing, so if targets beyond the first provide an additional chance to proc the whole spell, it's a lower chance.

Alternatively, the game doesn't have to follow simple binomial probability rules; stochastic observables follow the behavior of a game system, not the mathematical rules of a (virtual) real world physics. For example, the game could detect server-side how many targets are hit by the original cast, then have a table it checks to see what the chance of a proc is with that many valid proc targets, and finally, roll against that table. A lookup table solution is less elegant than a formulaic solution, but we don't know the right model to represent the empirical data yet.

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They have "fixed" enhancements mana gain for now it seems.

Never got below 29k (max of 32k mana on my 87 shaman). They also added a lot of new subtle lightning effects to Stormstrike.

Also for the Echo discussion that's going on: I haven't confirmed it myself, but I observed that it also seems (Visually at least) to affect Fire Nova resulting in a boatload of AOE. I noticed foremost that there's always an explosion after all the others have gone through.

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Also for the Echo discussion that's going on: I haven't confirmed it myself, but I observed that it also seems (Visually at least) to affect Fire Nova resulting in a boatload of AOE. I noticed foremost that there's always an explosion after all the others have gone through.

That is strange as Echo of Elements tooltip clearly says that it affects direct damage spells only. I'll try to confirm it and report if it's true.

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I tried to duplicate Fire Nova on two adds in Jade Forest and it definitely works. When having two targets, one with flame shock, Fire Nova did damage to one target and again after a second. I managed to duplicate that spell many times and with flame shock on all targets. Reported.

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I looked through all the available glyphs and found Glyph of Flame Shock interesting to analyse for a dmg bonus. (/edit tooltip is wrong - just click it for the correct tooltip)

So glyphed FS dmg will be 0.75*[initial dmg] + 1.25*[periodic dmg].

Each tick will do the same dmg with or without the glyph.

This results in:

  • Each one application of glyphed FS does more dmg than unglyphed.
  • Over the same time window, unglyphed FS does more DPS than glyphed FS (assuming same uptime), because each apllication does more dmg and we may have more of them.

Regarding Enhancement:

Using the glyph gives us 1 free shock CD every 4 FS (= 120 seconds = 5 unglyphed FS) - thus giving us 1 more ES - while losing 4 times on the difference of the initial dmg and 1 complete initial dmg.

So, what's better?

Some numbers from the beta:

My FS does something about 3.4k Initial dmg and about 11k periodic dmg unglyphed.

Glyphed numbers change to 2550 initial and 13750 periodic.

Initial dmg drops by 850.

ES is at almost 7k.

If I manage to get an extra ES every 4 FS I gain I'll gain:

Optimal case: 7000-4*850-3400 = 200 dmg over 120 seconds = 1.666DPS (Woooh yeah!).

Anything else is a DPS loss (uhhh =( )

I admit, that's just nothing. Adding UE_Flames to this increases the absolute difference even more und might turn the whole into a complete loss.

But something to add:

  • Glyphed FS (30 seconds) fits better with our UE CD (15 seconds). Maybe this is be interesting for someone.
  • The 30 seconds will also be spread via LL. (Tested on SW dummies)

Regarding Elemental:

Well, since Ele does not use shocks on CD basis regulary, we need another model:

We can compare the freed GCD to LB as a filler.

Its safe to asume that every 2 free GCDs (240 secs) will give you enough time to cast another LB. (under optimal circumstances with enough haste or proccs you could gain 1 LB every 120 sec)

Using the numbers from a premade Elemental shaman:

Loosing 2600 - 2000 = 600 FS initial dmg on each apllication.

LB dmg: 12k

So for 2 free GCDs: 12000 - 8*600 - 2*2600 = 2000 over 240 seconds = 8.333 DPS

For 1 free GCD: 12000 - 4*600 - 2600 = 7000 over 120 seconds = 58.333 DPS

As a little extra bonus: your management of Fulmination might get easier too.

Facit:

Blizz is doing a good job at keeping overall dmg nearly inaffected by glpyhs or talents.

Anyway it is nice to know that Enhancement will most of the time lose with the FS glyph while Elemental has a minor gain.

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I think you are underestimating the value for Elemental. In my gear a base non-crit lightning bolt is close to double the damage you used and that is ignoring crits, overloads and lightning shield charges generated. A more realistic value would probably be something like 35k (or more), which gives results between 104 dps and 250 dps using your math.

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I think so too, since I only used the raw tooltip numbers from a premade shaman (which cannot even wear their given belts *sigh*) without any buffs or something.

So yeah, I thought that the actual numbers will be higher - and that's just good.

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Regarding tier 3/level 45 talents(resto PoV):

Right off the bat Call of the Elements seems like an obvious choice, but Totemic Restoration is in my opinion completely viable as well.

Call of the Elements pros:

-Allows use of both SLT and HTT two times in a row, allowing really strong burst healing and protection(SLT).

-Increases the uptime on SLT, HTT and MTT.

Totemic Restoration pros:

-Allows a more frequent usage of MTT, HTT, Grounding Totem(situational) and SLT for a more steady performance rather than burst.

-Prevents the last part of CDs to be wasted in case raid is stable after CDs have been used.

-Works really good with Totemic Recall(glyphed), basically makes HTT and SLT manafree.

In most scenarios SLT's first tick is always the most important. It usually(for me anyway) saves the tank on very low HP, and then everything is fine again, making the ticks after the first less worthy(and sometimes completely wated). That is the most important thing to notice, because Totemic Restoration allows you to use SLT for the first tick, save the tank, and pull it back up and have it ready within 1,5 min - dobbles the amount of "first ticks"

I have been testing it out a bit on beta, Totemic Restoration doesn't seem to work 100% correctly, but will probably get fixed, it's beta anyway. If I detroy a totem at 50% duration, it doesn't reduce the CD by 50% but less than that.

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Echo of the Elements (Resto)

I've been playing around with the Echo of the Elements talent for resto on beta 15781. At first I was expecting to see something in the combat log to identify a second proc for a given cast such as "Gruknar's Echo of the Elements casts..." but the log just identifies that there's a second cast of the same spell, which I guess makes sense but doesn't make it particularly easy to identify.

I was keen to identify if the 2nd spell (caused by Echo) was able to crit, and if so, would it be able to proc Ancestral Awakening, Resurgence or Earthliving.

I haven't had a chance for extensive testing, but I can confirm that the 2nd (Echo) spell is able to crit, irrespective of the original spell not critting. This doesn't fit with the tooltip that states: "When one of your spells causes direct damage or healing, you have a chance to gain Echo of the Elements, duplicating that spell's effect.".

I was alternating between Healing Wave and Greater HW to make easy identification in the combat log. So when my normal cast doesn't crit and the Echo spell does crit, I can also confirm that Ancestral Awakening does proc from Echo but Resurgence does not.

Not enough testing done to see if a 1st crit and echo crit will proc two AAs.

It's worth noting that if the original cast does proc Echo, the AA for that first cast is appearing after the Echo spell in the combat log.

The actual proc rate for Echo in general is low, but as a flat passive, it's rather quite nice to have.

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Further to my last post about Echo of the Elements procs being able to cause AA / Resurgence / Earthliving, I've managed to do a much longer (~400 casts) test on the latest Beta (15799).

The full log file is here: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis.

Most notable information:

  • Echo procs can crit irrespective of initial spell critting
  • Echo procs that do crit do proc Ancestral Awakening
  • Echo procs are not proccing Resurgence
  • Earthliving proc / refresh on Echo not seen
  • There is no apparent internal cooldown on Echo proccing
  • 458 HW casts, 42 Echo procs = 9.17% proc rate on my sample.

Some useful parts of the full log:


Echo critting, initial cast not:

[10:13:20.856] Fdgfdgfds begins to cast Healing Wave

[10:13:23.024] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 20237)

[10:13:23.306] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +*0* (O: 41457)


No ICD seen (3 procs back to back):

[10:10:57.919] Fdgfdgfds begins to cast Healing Wave

[10:11:00.069] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 19843)

[10:11:00.069] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 20480)

[10:11:00.937] Fdgfdgfds begins to cast Healing Wave

[10:11:03.119] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +*0* (O: 40007)

[10:11:03.354] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 20698)

[10:11:03.952] Fdgfdgfds begins to cast Healing Wave

[10:11:06.104] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 20718)

[10:11:06.104] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 20694)


Initial and Echo proc critting and both causing AA but not Resurgence:

[10:10:12.234] Fdgfdgfds begins to cast Healing Wave

[10:10:13.634] Fdgfdgfds Earthliving Fdgfdgfds +*0* (O: 4482)

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +*0* (O: 41592)

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds gains 2635 mana from Fdgfdgfds's Resurgence

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds's Ancestral Vigor is refreshed by Fdgfdgfds

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds gains Expansive Mind (8) from Fdgfdgfds

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds gains Velocity from Fdgfdgfds

[10:10:14.384] Fdgfdgfds Healing Wave Fdgfdgfds +*0* (O: 43065)

[10:10:14.767] Fdgfdgfds's Ancestral Vigor is refreshed by Fdgfdgfds

[10:10:14.767] Fdgfdgfds Ancestral Awakening Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 12477)

[10:10:15.267] Fdgfdgfds Ancestral Awakening Fdgfdgfds +0 (O: 12920)

e: proc chance and sample size

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That proc rate is very good when compared with elemental mastery and ancestral swiftness. Both those alternatives provide an average 5% haste (AS gives a bit more with the instant cast on use effect), which is a pure 5% bonus to hps throughput, but also a 5% increase to mps costs. In a perfect no-overheal environment, echo provides double the hps benefit with your observed proc rate with no mana cost, an attractive choice for efficiency.

Of course single target heals like those you tested will have significant overhealing on echo heals, providing balance. I'm curious how chain heal echo procs will work. Will it just duplicate the healing effect on individual targets? Or will the whole chain be duplicated, including the possibility to pick new smart heal targets? I can make or copy a warlock to the beta and spam life tap to help you test group heals if you're willing to continue your research.

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Nice thinking Jessamy.

I managed to get a couple friendly Warlocks to Life Tap while I CHeal spammed. It wasn't the most organised of tests, but I did prove a couple things:

  • CHeal can proc Echo
  • When CHeal procs from Echo, the whole spell is duplicated
  • The CHeal Echo was targeting the lower HP of my two test subjects

Full log: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Log snippet:


7/1 12:25:58.822  SPELL_CAST_START,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0x80000000,0x80000000,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8


7/1 12:25:58.822  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000048E995,"Tricel",0x10512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,15205,0,0,nil

7/1 12:25:58.822  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0100000000493474,"Lockisocki",0x512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,22273,0,0,nil


7/1 12:26:01.222  SPELL_CAST_START,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0x80000000,0x80000000,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8


7/1 12:26:01.332  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0100000000493474,"Lockisocki",0x512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,14720,0,0,nil

7/1 12:26:01.332  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000048E995,"Tricel",0x10512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,22164,0,0,nil


7/1 12:26:02.103  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000048E995,"Tricel",0x10512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,14952,0,0,nil

7/1 12:26:02.103  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0100000000493474,"Lockisocki",0x512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,19996,0,0,nil


7/1 12:26:03.453  SPELL_CAST_START,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0x80000000,0x80000000,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8


7/1 12:26:03.453  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0100000000493474,"Lockisocki",0x512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,14292,0,0,nil

7/1 12:26:03.453  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000048E995,"Tricel",0x10512,0x0,1064,"Chain Heal",0x8,20973,0,0,nil

I agree that Echo is a nice passive talent for Resto, yes it will create higher overheal, but as a flat passive, i'm happy with it.

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And this follow up on Echo:

Will Echo be able to proc from Elemental's mastery? I would assume not, but the wording on the talent doesn't make it clear one way or the other. Also, does the effect have any type of internal cool down?

Yes, Overloads can be Echoed. Echo only has a very short ICD to prevent it from triggering from multiple hits of the same spellcast.

I'll try and do more Healing Wave testing to prove the 6% proc chance.

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With the 15799 beta build, and the stated 6% proc chance of Echo of the Elements for Resto, I can confirm that:

  • 1100 Healing Wave casts
  • 1164 Healing Wave heals
  • 64 procs
  • 5.82% proc chance

Close enough to be as stated. Also tested how Unleash Elements (Life) was working with Echo. Echo can proc a second heal for EL and it also refreshes the buff (no, they don't stack):


7/6 12:19:46.257  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,7618,7618,0,nil

7/6 12:19:46.267  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:19:46.267  SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73680,"Unleash Elements",0x8

7/6 12:19:46.267  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,105284,"Ancestral Vigor",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:19:46.267  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,107962,"Expansive Mind",0x1,BUFF

7/6 12:19:56.249  SPELL_AURA_REMOVED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:19:56.249  SPELL_AURA_REMOVED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,107962,"Expansive Mind",0x1,BUFF

7/6 12:20:01.259  SPELL_AURA_REMOVED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,105284,"Ancestral Vigor",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:20:03.529  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,14942,14942,0,1

7/6 12:20:03.529  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:20:03.529  SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73680,"Unleash Elements",0x8

Finally, using EL followed by GHW, found that Echo procs on the GHW do not benefit from the EL enhanced buff:

7/6 12:16:13.476  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,7463,7463,0,nil

7/6 12:16:13.476  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:16:13.476  SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73680,"Unleash Elements",0x8

7/6 12:16:13.476  SPELL_AURA_REFRESH,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,105284,"Ancestral Vigor",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:16:13.476  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,107962,"Expansive Mind",0x1,BUFF

7/6 12:16:14.986  SPELL_CAST_START,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0x80000000,0x80000000,77472,"Greater Healing Wave",0x8

7/6 12:16:17.156  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,77472,"Greater Healing Wave",0x8,46481,46481,0,nil

7/6 12:16:17.156  SPELL_AURA_REMOVED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,73685,"Unleash Life",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:16:17.486  SPELL_AURA_REFRESH,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,105284,"Ancestral Vigor",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:16:17.486  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,51945,"Earthliving",0x8,BUFF

7/6 12:16:17.496  SPELL_AURA_APPLIED_DOSE,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,107962,"Expansive Mind",0x1,BUFF,2

7/6 12:16:17.496  SPELL_HEAL,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,0x010000000002E0D9,"Fdgfdgfds",0x511,0x0,77472,"Greater Healing Wave",0x8,36951,36951,0,nil

e: copy paste fail

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Am I mistaken in thinking that the level 45 talents have a clear dps winner? Neither Call of the Elements nor Totemic Projection have much dps use but Totemic Restoration would allow one to better buff elementals with trinket procs, correct (under the impression that elementals now update constantly instead of snapshoting stats)?

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Am I mistaken in thinking that the level 45 talents have a clear dps winner? Neither Call of the Elements nor Totemic Projection have much dps use but Totemic Restoration would allow one to better buff elementals with trinket procs, correct (under the impression that elementals now update constantly instead of snapshoting stats)?

There's some definite potential here.

Using Kiroptyric Sigil as an example, you could use the fire ele glyph and recall him at 18 seconds to give you a new CD of 1:30 (which lines up perfectly with your trinket CD. Your ele would then only be up when your trinket it up and would gain 2k+ agility for 15 seconds of his 18 second life (83% uptime).

It gets a bit trickier when you start using trinkets with different ICDs since things won't line up this perfectly. Also Totemic Recall uses a GCD so that needs to be factored into the equation (EDIT: You can just right click kill it without the GCD hit) . Definitely something to test in the enhsim or simc once they are updated.

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It would seem the devs don't intend the talent to work this way (and that the tooltip is horribly misleading).

The Totemic Restoration talent does not appear to be working as the spell description indicates on totems with longer than a 1 minute CD.

The examples you gave seem to match what is intended. The cooldown is reduced by half the percentage of the duration that was lost. If your Spirit Link totem is pulled back up after 3sec (50% lost duration), its cooldown will be reduced by 25% of the full cooldown, or 45sec.

The devs seem fairly convinced they don't want that tier to benefit performance (as opposed to situational utility) in any way.

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