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Mearis

Shadowpriest Theory Craft - 3.2.2 Edition!

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At the moment I'm usually finding myself between #1 and #5 on WWS, though one of the reasons could be that I'm currently one of our best equipped DDs (itemlvl-wise).

Wow Web Stats

Some people in the log are still completely lvl 70 equipped or lack a bunch of hit, so this shouldnt be taken as a realistic comparison.

Hey!, this is my armory: The World of Warcraft Armory

I got a ring, with 39 hit, and a trinket with 55 hit and a belt with 40~ hit which replaces the other gear, so i got around 1400 Spellpower with that gear and some less crit, mayb 12% instead of 14,58%.

And on bosses i'm around 2200 dps, And i'm wondering if i am doing something wrong with my rotation, since you do a whooping 1k more dps... (on bosses this is) My rotation is usually, VE ->swd->DP->MB->SW.P(if full scorch) else mf->sw.p.

Then i go with prio

1 VE

2 MB

3 DP

4 SW.D

5 MF.

if there is like 0,5 sec cd on MB i skip doing MF and do MB.

same with DP.

Is this correct? I've read on shadowpriest.com that it could be better(atleast mana-wise with almost no dps decrease, that you should skip SW.D).

Thanks

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Buffed and grouped i run around 2200-2600 spellpower, so I guess you're doing it right.

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At the moment I'm usually finding myself between #1 and #5 on WWS, though one of the reasons could be that I'm currently one of our best equipped DDs (itemlvl-wise).

Wow Web Stats

Some people in the log are still completely lvl 70 equipped or lack a bunch of hit, so this shouldnt be taken as a realistic comparison.

The other classes tend to surge ahead once they complete their 4 piece bonus, we have nothing like that to really strive for since ours is pretty lack luster. Maybe with the corresponding glyph, it might be ok, but after trying the glyph out I really missed the 10 extra yards on Mindflay. Especially on movement based fights.

Also the Mindflay clipping bug is still present and it seems like the more haste I have, or if Bloodlust/Heroism is active, the more it clips; but that's speculation. I've been having way too much fun to really dive into any detective work. At least there was a blue post over the last few days reminding us that they're looking into it.

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I just think with the current gear in game, shadowpriests 'cap out' at 4k dps or so, while hunters/mages can clear 5k easily enough. That's at least 20% margin, which is a lot higher than a 5-10% increase that GC was talking about.

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I got a ring, with 39 hit, and a trinket with 55 hit and a belt with 40~ hit which replaces the other gear, so i got around 1400 Spellpower with that gear and some less crit, mayb 12% instead of 14,58%.

Your gear is very sub-par atm. Your hit is VERY far off and your spell power is about 200 off where you'd be doing gobtons of DPS. Remember, hit is the most important stat to look at until you're capped. You'll make up a ton of the DPS you're lacking just if you hit more. Also, for the love of god, level some professions.

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Maybe with the corresponding glyph, it might be ok, but after trying the glyph out I really missed the 10 extra yards on Mindflay. Especially on movement based fights.

Also, on Malygos, during phase 2, the MF glyph really helps a lot or you can't use it.

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After malygos and naxx25, I really don't see a way to do without the MF glyph, or a reason to for that matter. Beyond using it to stack SW at the beginning of a fight, or after a heavy movement cycle where it drops off, I don't find myself casting at all. Perhaps adding the SW:D glyph with the t7 4pc would make it more worthwhile, and I'll check that out once I get there, but for now, MF seems the way to go.

Also, after doing some 10 man stuff and a whole crapton of heroics, I decided i needed veiled shadows to stay in mana. After clearing naxx 25, I've decided I don't. In basically entry level raid gear (2 badge hit items and 2-3 heroic epics, ect.) I was fine on every encounter using only my fiend and dispursion (only used dispursion 3-4 times through the whole instance). I drank 1 mana potion through the entire encounter... on sapp I think.

1 more talent item I'd like to make note of... for trash mind sear + blackout = tits. So sweet to see multiple mobs with swirlies popping up as my 2k crits float above them. Obviously blackout is personal pref, but it really is quite nice for everything but bosses, lol.

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Your gear is very sub-par atm. Your hit is VERY far off and your spell power is about 200 off where you'd be doing gobtons of DPS. Remember, hit is the most important stat to look at until you're capped. You'll make up a ton of the DPS you're lacking just if you hit more. Also, for the love of god, level some professions.

Maybe i wrote abit confusing. With my ring, trinket and belt I'm hit capped. (300hit). And buffed I have around 1875 spellpower.

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Hey!, this is my armory: The World of Warcraft Armory

I got a ring, with 39 hit, and a trinket with 55 hit and a belt with 40~ hit which replaces the other gear, so i got around 1400 Spellpower with that gear and some less crit, mayb 12% instead of 14,58%.

And on bosses i'm around 2200 dps, And i'm wondering if i am doing something wrong with my rotation, since you do a whooping 1k more dps... (on bosses this is) My rotation is usually, VE ->swd->DP->MB->SW.P(if full scorch) else mf->sw.p.

Then i go with prio

1 VE

2 MB

3 DP

4 SW.D

5 MF.

if there is like 0,5 sec cd on MB i skip doing MF and do MB.

same with DP.

Is this correct? I've read on shadowpriest.com that it could be better(atleast mana-wise with almost no dps decrease, that you should skip SW.D).

Thanks

Priority is wrong, also I presume you mean VT when you say VE.

Opening should be

VT->DP->MB->SW:D->SW:P->VE->MF

Ideally you want your highest priority spells to come off CD first

Priority should be

1. VT

2. DP

3. MB

4. VE

5. MF

SW:D should only be cast

1. To get the two initial stacks of shadow weaving

2. When moving

3. When you have 1.5sec spare until a VT/DP runs out or MB comes off CD

Edit: My apologies, it seems that most of what I've said was posted by the OP anyway.

Two questions:

1. Black magic is terrible right? From what I've read on wowhead the DPS is worse than 63 SP, and it uses up a much needed debuff slot

2. I'm out of the loop a bit, is there anyway to make Inner focus/Devouring plague a one button click without /stopcasting? Being on an oceanic server, I find it tends to lag a little bit, sometimes not getting DP off unless I'm spamming the button, and I lose about a second worth of cast time.

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I'm purely speculating and I haven't had a chance to compare this initial rotation versus a more customary one on a training dummy and I don't know if its appropriate for this thread, but would this alternative initial spell casting sequence yield a higher initial dps (albeit at the cost of higher initial threat)

1) MB

2) SWD

3) VT

4) DP

5) MB

6) SWP

In addition to the huge amount of threat you can cause in 1.5 seconds (mb + swd crit for ~10k) you miss out on having a full stack of shadow weaving as well as the misery debuff for your first mind blast, but you do get 2 mind blasts in the first 9 seconds of the fight which is a bonus.

I've been trying this alternative initial spellcasting rotation during raids and I found it has made me a bit more efficient on trash because I've been used to doing the VT->DP->MB->SWD rotation on bosses and then doing the same on trash where front loading dots is usually inefficient.

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I've been using a priority system with my DPS abilities where I always make sure VT is up, then I make sure MB is on cooldown, then I make sure DP is up, and if all of that is taken care of, I'll MF. For some reason still, MF is still the largest piece of my overall dps, coming in at almost 1/3 of the total on Patchwerk. Seems a bit weird o.O

Wow Web Stats

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I just think with the current gear in game, shadowpriests 'cap out' at 4k dps or so, while hunters/mages can clear 5k easily enough. That's at least 20% margin, which is a lot higher than a 5-10% increase that GC was talking about.

Yeah that sucks for sure that it isnt what it should be.. but could it also be because of our VE? Even though nerfed to only give back 5% to party and that is some of the reason for the difference. Although it shouldnt matter and thats the reason why it was nerfed in the first place.

(Merged by Snowy)

Also, anyone have a rotation setup for multiple mobs IE AoE? What works best for max dps.. which dots if any to be applied to the mobs then mind sear to follow. I was thinking VT for each mob since its uses up its own gc while casting then MS any thoughts on this?

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Hey Guys,

Just wondering if anyone has any hard theorycrafting on Black Magic vs 63 Spellpower to MH. I've heard conflicting things but wanted to see what other shadowpriests are using.

thanks

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63 Spellpower would be more of a DPS upgrade than Black Magic would. It's a non-scaling dot that looks to have a 30-45 sec cooldown, and it doesn't benefit from any talents. 63 spellpower is constant, always active, and benefits us entirely.

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Also, anyone have a rotation setup for multiple mobs IE AoE? What works best for max dps.. which dots if any to be applied to the mobs then mind sear to follow. I was thinking VT for each mob since its uses up its own gc while casting then MS any thoughts on this?

Spam mind sear. Early & often.

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Since Mind Sear doesn't actually damage the target, I find it doesn't make much sense if there are only three mobs in the pack. In that scenario, Mind Sear will only damage two of them and I'm probably better off stacking DoTs and using single-target nukes.

In packs of four or more, however, Mind Sear really shines. Fade also allows Shadow Priests to be really aggressive about riding the threat envelope early in the pull. (And there's always Dispersion if things go really, really wrong.)

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Hum, I have my recount showing 1500 dps at best, and that's after I realized I was clipping my mindflay's last tick. I'm running 1500~ sp and aroudn 10% crit, mostly dungeon blues and epics, and that kirin robe. I actually got a pattern down for my dps, if its any good though. After getting touch and death up, you flay, blast, then either touch/plague/death for that last gcd for MB's CD, then blast again. Usually touch first if its dropping off, need to do that with plague as well.

Highest I've seen it was 1800, but that was in heroics.

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You realize you can spend 2 GCDs on an initial target (Devouring Plague and Vampiric Touch) then Mind Sear and get full AoE capability on 3-mob packs? Even better if you assist a death knight with Devouring Plague since they can spread it and make it more damaging with Pestilence and Ebon Plaguebringer, respectively.

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You realize you can spend 2 GCDs on an initial target (Devouring Plague and Vampiric Touch) then Mind Sear and get full AoE capability on 3-mob packs? Even better if you assist a death knight with Devouring Plague since they can spread it and make it more damaging with Pestilence and Ebon Plaguebringer, respectively.

That can work pretty well when the mobs have high health, but much of the time I find that one of the mobs in the pack is getting focus fire and is only going to live a few more seconds by the time I'm done casting a single VT + DP combo. I only get a tick or two of Mind Sear in before it's dead. I've had better results stacking DoTs on the other two mobs and then throwing a quick Mind Blast and perhaps a SWD on the focus fire mob right before it dies.

I didn't know that DKs could spread Devouring Plague. That's pretty cool.

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The other classes tend to surge ahead once they complete their 4 piece bonus, we have nothing like that to really strive for since ours is pretty lack luster.

Speaking of our 4 piece bonus, is it INTENDED that blizz wants us to use SWD more when mobs are below 35% (+10% crit & +10% damage from glyph)? Has anyone done the math to see if it does improves our dps if we add SWD to our rotation at 35%?

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Just curious, how much DPS are each of you getting self-buffed on target dummies? I have a horrible feeling I'm failing hard right now... I need to gear up.

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According to the latest SimulationCraft, SWD was 7% of the damage at a simulated 4988dps, which clocks out at 349dps from the SWD spell alone. That was at 17.6% crit.

349 / 1.17 = 298 dps (without crit)

298 * 1.27 = 378 dps (with +10% crit)

So that's a delta of +29 dps, or around 0.5% extra, bringing it up to 5017 dps. Compare that to the non-SWD simulation of 4988.

In other words, it doesn't look to be something that would single-handedly convince you to add SWD into your rotation simply on its own merits. SWD scales terribly by design now, so there's no reason to expect a set bonus to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

--

Caveat: SimulationCraft says that their figures use a "Naxx10" kit, but they don't specify the exact gear and they don't break down crit percentage on a per-spell basis. If they are using T7.10 gear, it is possible that the SWD bonus is already baked into the simulated figure of 4988dps, but even with double-dipping the bonus would still just be noise around the edges.

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You realize you can spend 2 GCDs on an initial target (Devouring Plague and Vampiric Touch) then Mind Sear and get full AoE capability on 3-mob packs? Even better if you assist a death knight with Devouring Plague since they can spread it and make it more damaging with Pestilence and Ebon Plaguebringer, respectively.

I did a couple of heroics tonight with a DK and this worked beautifully. Thanks for the tip.

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According to the latest SimulationCraft, SWD was 7% of the damage at a simulated 4988dps, which clocks out at 349dps from the SWD spell alone. That was at 17.6% crit.

349 / 1.17 = 298 dps (without crit)

298 * 1.27 = 378 dps (with +10% crit)

So that's a delta of +29 dps, or around 0.5% extra, bringing it up to 5017 dps. Compare that to the non-SWD simulation of 4988.

In other words, it doesn't look to be something that would single-handedly convince you to add SWD into your rotation simply on its own merits. SWD scales terribly by design now, so there's no reason to expect a set bonus to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

--

Caveat: SimulationCraft says that their figures use a "Naxx10" kit, but they don't specify the exact gear and they don't break down crit percentage on a per-spell basis. If they are using T7.10 gear, it is possible that the SWD bonus is already baked into the simulated figure of 4988dps, but even with double-dipping the bonus would still just be noise around the edges.

The SW:D bonus only applies if you have the tier 7 set bonus enabled for the Priest profile. Which (given I only added Priest tier7 support in recently) it isn't.

As for the gear: Here are the stats used in the Priest_14_0_57 profile:

default_stamina=708

default_intellect=777

default_spirit=411

default_spell_power=2200

default_crit_rating=461

default_hit_rating=290

default_haste_rating=452

On top of that there's also a Flask of the Frost Wyrm, Tender Shoveltusk Steak and (Improved) Inner Fire.

So I'd say it's more along the lines of Naxx25 gear.

The profile also has:

chaotic_skyflare=1

glyph_shadow_word_pain=1

glyph_shadow=1

glyph_shadow_word_death=1

It would be possible to add in the effect of tier 7 with:

tier7_2pc=1

tier7_4pc=1

(Note: this format might change. Dedmon has said he's not too sure about using it this way. But for now, they model the set bonuses).

(Note: most of the various profiles use that default gear set. Some with small changes in one stat at the expense of others).

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Caveat: SimulationCraft says that their figures use a "Naxx10" kit, but they don't specify the exact gear and they don't break down crit percentage on a per-spell basis.

If you scroll down past all the eye-candy on SampleOutput you will reach a wall-of-text section with detailed spell break-downs for each profile......

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