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Faerdael

WotLK Gem Index

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This thread is to provide a quick reference of gem prioritizaton for hunters in the Wrath of the Lich King expansion. It is still recommended to consult the Hunter spreadsheet for a more detailed assesment of your personal gearing. Subject to change. Feedback is of course appreciated.

Beast Mastery

Red:

[item]Bright Cardinal Ruby[/item]

[item]Bright Dragon's Eye[/item] (*Jewelcrafting only)

Yellow:

[item]Rigid King's Amber[/item] (*if severely under hit cap.)

[item]Rigid Dragon's Eye[/item] (*if severly under hit cap, Jewelcrafting only)

Blue:

Not recommended.

Orange:

[item]Pristine Ametrine[/item] (*if not hit capped)

[item]Wicked Ametrine[/item] (*if hit capped)

Purple:

[item]Infused Dreadstone[/item]

[item]Balanced Dreadstone[/item] (*if mana is a non-factor)

Green:

[item]Lambent Eye of Zul[/item] (*if not hit capped)

[item]Vivid Eye of Zul[/item] (*if not hit capped, and mana is a non-factor)

[item]Sundered Eye of Zul[/item] (*if hit capped)

[item]Jagged Eye of Zul[/item] (*if hit capped, and mana is a non-factor)

*Green gems are only advisable if to satisfy Meta requirement for both 1 Yellow and 1 Blue gem value. However, using a prismatic gem is generally superior to available greens.

Prismatic:

[iTEM]Nightmare Tear[/iTEM]

*A prismatic gem will fill all the requirements for Meta gem. In 3.2, the epic level prismatic gem is almost always a superior option to either purple or green gems for filling Meta requirements.

Meta:

[item]Relentless Earthsiege Diamond[/item]

Marksman

Red:

[item]Bright Cardinal Ruby[/item] or [item]Delicate Cardinal Ruby[/item] or [item]Fractured Cardinal Ruby[/item]

[item]Bright Dragon's Eye[/item] or [item]Delicate Dragon's Eye[/item] or [item]Fractured Dragon's Eye[/item] (*Jewelcrafting only)

Yellow:

[item]Rigid King's Amber[/item] (*if severely under hit cap.)

[item]Rigid Dragon's Eye[/item] (*if severly under hit cap, Jewelcrafting only)

Blue:

Not recommended.

Orange:

[item]Pristine Ametrine[/item] or [item]Glinting Ametrine[/item] (*if under hit cap)

[item]Wicked Ametrine[/item] or [item]Deadly Ametrine[/item] (*if hit capped, and over haste "soft-cap")

Purple:

[item]Infused Dreadstone[/item] or [item]Tenuous Dreadstone[/item] or [item]Puissant Dreadstone[/item]

[item]Balanced Dreadstone[/item] or [item]Shifting Dreadstone[/item] (*if mana is a non-factor)

Green:

[item]Lambent Eye of Zul[/item] (*if not hit capped)

[item]Vivid Eye of Zul[/item] (*if not hit capped, and mana is a non-factor)

[item]Sundered Eye of Zul[/item] (*if hit capped and over haste "soft-cap")

[item]Jagged Eye of Zul[/item] (*if hit capped, over haste "soft-cap", and mana is a non-factor)

*Green gems are only advisable if to satisfy Meta requirement for both 1 Yellow and 1 Blue gem value. However, when using rare quality gems, using a prismatic gem is generally superior to available greens.

Prismatic:

[iTEM]Nightmare Tear[/iTEM]

*A prismatic gem will fill all the requirements for Meta gem. In 3.2, the epic level prismatic gem is almost always a superior option to either purple or green gems for filling Meta requirements.

Meta:

[item]Relentless Earthsiege Diamond[/item]

Three different options are listed for Marksman gemming. Raw attack power, Agility, and Armor Penetration. Attack power gems only seem to be beneficial for MM specs at the most entry level gearing (~200 and below ilvl). Armor Penetration gemming becomes viable at higher levels of gear past a certain threshold of ArP (generally ~650). The spreadsheet is the best indicator of when ArP passes Agility.

Survival

Red:

[item]Delicate Cardinal Ruby[/item]

[item]Delicate Dragon's Eye[/item] (*Jewelcrafting only)

Yellow:

[item]Rigid King's Amber[/item] (**if severely under hit cap.)

[item]Rigid Dragon's Eye[/item] (*if severly under hit cap, Jewelcrafting only)

Blue:

Not recommended.

Orange:

[item]Glinting Ametrine[/item] (*if under hit cap)

[item]Deadly Ametrine[/item] (*if hit capped.)

Purple

[item]Shifting Dreadstone[/item]

Green:

[item]Vivid Eye of Zul[/item] (*if not hit capped)

[item]Jagged Eye of Zul[/item] (*if hit capped)

*Green gems are only advisable if to satisfy Meta requirement for both 1 Yellow and 1 Blue gem value. However, when using rare quality gems, using a prismatic gem is generally superior to available greens.

Prismatic:

[item]Nightmare Tear[/item]

*A prismatic gem will fill all the requirements for Meta gem. In 3.2, the epic level prismatic gem is almost always a superior option to either purple or green gems for filling Meta requirements.

Meta:

[item]Relentless Earthsiege Diamond[/item]

A few notes:

This is gauged primarily from spreadsheet calculations and existing in-game items. This does not suggest gemming values based on extended time durations (ie. the value of gemming a [item]Brilliant King's Amber[/item]). The following talents are assumed: Serpent Swiftness for BM, Combat Experience for MM, Hunter vs Wild + Lightning Reflexes for Surv, and Careful Aim for all specs.

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General calculations are indicating that 2 Attack Power is currently of a higher DPS value than 1 Agility for 2 of the 3 hunter trees, which was the opposite of Burning Crusade standards. The exception to this is the Survival hunter, who receives +15% bonus to Agility, which tips the scales toward Agility as the more valuable stat. The marksman talent Combat Experience also provides an Agility multiplier, but does not appear to be sufficient to cause any shift in gem priority. No yellow gems were added other than Hit as they did not appear to yield any DPS over Orange options (this could change). Currently, WoW v3.0.8 changes to hunter DPS do not appear to alter gem prioritization.

At the top end of currently avaialbe gear and typical raid buffs (~6k AP and 45% crit) Agility is ahead of AP by 3% (.996 versus .967). At low end gear with 16 points in BM, AP was ahead for me but agility quickly overtook it. Gemming for Agility will also let you switch between marks and survival without regemming.

Marks is close enought that you should Gem AP if you might try out BM and gem AGI if you might raid as SV sometimes.

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Jander, I see roughly the same with your toon on paper. About a .03 net dps gain switching from a Bright to a Delicate. With BM its rather pronounced that AP is superior and the invert is true for Survival. I'll really have to rethink how to describe MM. I'll revise accordingly.

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I was in the middle of a long post explaining that for MMs with 4% agility from Combat Experience how agility versions of AP gems are viable options since they have similar DPS and the agility gems also provide a little more dodge (0.25%), 32 armor, and more crit (0.22%), with the crit helping with abilities or items that proc from it. Then I saw the updates you made already per Jander's note and deleted most of it. Some good options that you are still missing for MM are:

Purple:

- [item]Tenuous Twilight Opal[/item] or [item]Balanced Twilight Opal[/item] - since I do not have mana problems in raids I find the agi/AP + sta version the most useful

Green:

- [item]Vivid Forest Emerald[/item] - if you need hit and once again the sta instead of mp5 version for more survivability and do not have OOM problems

- [item]Forceful Forest Emerald[/item] - if you need haste

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How about [iTEM]Enchanted Tear[/iTEM] for satisfying the blue gem requirement? At a glance, it seems like 6 Agi 6 Int 6 Stam is comparable to the purple options listed here.

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I think we'll probably see agility surpass AP again, on the 1:2 ratio next patch, with the nerf of the Steady Shot AP co-efficient. I haven't run any actual numbers on it, but it seems like a pretty solid guess to make.

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AP > AGI for quite some time as MM currently, but the amount by which is very very marginal. AP will probably always be better for BM because of how AP bleeds to pets.

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I think we'll probably see agility surpass AP again, on the 1:2 ratio next patch, with the nerf of the Steady Shot AP co-efficient. I haven't run any actual numbers on it, but it seems like a pretty solid guess to make.

This has been discussed before in some other threads. Short answer: no, AP will be worth the same amount relative to agi for BM as as it is worth now, if not more so.

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Jander, I see roughly the same with your toon on paper. About a .03 net dps gain switching from a Bright to a Delicate. With BM its rather pronounced that AP is superior and the invert is true for Survival. I'll really have to rethink how to describe MM. I'll revise accordingly.

I have no idea which gem comes out on top for a Marksmanship build, but I think the difference is so small that we can basically have two types of Hunters:

Those who gem with Brights (AP) and can pretty effectively switch between BM and Marks specs.

Those who gem with Delicate (Agil) and can very effectively switch between Marks and Survival specs.

I'm inclined to say Agility is better for Marksmanship cause of the little 4% boost the tree offers it... also Marks crit numbers are pretty high to say the least.

Marks Hunter with raid buffs:

100 Agility = 125.8 AP & 1.37% Crit

200 Attack = 220 AP

Survival Hunter with raid buffs:

100 Agility = 173.9 AP & 1.52% Crit

200 Attack = 220 AP

Obviously SV is the Agility spec, everyone knew that... but the scaling difference is quite pronounced compared to Marks, guess I just felt like doing a little math to show the difference.

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All else being equal, I am not a huge fan of Enchanted Tears. However, for agi-based characters (especially SV hunters), blue slots are currently problematic, since Shifting Twilight Opal (agi/sta) does not appear to be in game at current. In its absence, Enchanted Tear is probably the best option, at least for the first blue slot.

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Actually I am seeing [item]Enchanted Tear[/item] roughly on par with the Purple selections in-game currently, give or take, perhaps slightly under. Where they really shine is if needing a to fill both a Yellow and Blue socket for Meta requirements; I don't see any Green gems that are really comparable at the rare quality level (even +hit/(blue) gems). This is likely different at the epic gem level, since I don't believe there are any epic equivalents of the [item]Enchanted Tear[/item].

To elaborate on the AP gem topic, there are a few factors attributing to the apparent viability right now (for BM).

Agility at level 70 was worth .025% crit per point - at level 80 its down to .012% so the effective crit value is diminished while 14 AP still = 1 dps. Pet scaling has moved up to 22% and AP is the only value we have to directly scale up pet damage; with all the +damage modifiers in the BM tree, pets scale amazingly well with AP. Pre-WotLK, Agility got an extra +10% via Blessing of Kings in raids; in WotLK AP also scales by +10% in raid due to Trueshot Aura/Abomination's Might/Unleashed Rage. Lastly (and rather minor) is that Serpent Sting is now a viable part of the rotaion, and can only scale through AP.

I am noticing a few of these gem cuts may be currently not yet implemented (Shifting, Tenuous cuts?). If you notice one, please feel free to note it.

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Hmmm. So, is Agility currently beating Crit Rating in all cases? If not, it seems like [item]Chaotic Skyflare Diamond[/item] would be a good choice.

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Hmmm. So, is Agility currently beating Crit Rating in all cases? If not, it seems like [item]Chaotic Skyflare Diamond[/item] would be a good choice.

The fact that Agility is better aside, the extra blue gem requirement on the CSD is another hard knock against it.

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For hunters that want to improve the size of their mana pool [brilliant Autumn's Glow] (I apologize, I haven't learned how to link items yet) would be helpful. If you have [Careful Aim] as part of your talent build, then it will also be a direct DPS increse, albeit a small one.

Edit: Thank you Garby for the wonderful instructions on linking items. I linked the items in this post.

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For hunters that want to improve the size of their mana pool a Brilliant Autumn's Glow (I apologize, I havent learned how to link items yet) would be helpful. If you have Careful Aim as part of your talent build, then it will also be a direct DPS increse, albeit a small one.

The gem is actually pretty decent at increasing your AP; it provides the same amount of AP as an agility gem. However, it would really only be worthwhile if you needed to decrease your Viper uptime; in a 25 man raid, I can't seem to spend my mana no matter what; this isn't necessarily the case in a 10 man or heroic, however.

And to link items, type the text you want to appear; then, copy the URL from Wowhead, highlight the text you want to link to the item, and click the hyperlink button (the glove with a paperclip below it). Paste the URL into the field, and you will have an item link. For reference, I modified the items in your original post to be links, so you can make sure you're doing it right.

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Would a [item]Perfect Shifting Shadow Crystal[/item] be a feasible option until [item]Shifting Twilight Opal[/item] is implemented, you only lose 1 pt ea. agi/stam. I know it is an ugly green gem but the stats that you are looking for are there.

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looking at your gems for mm hunters.....what exactly is the haste "softcap" you mention....i cant find these numbers anywhere (though im sure its mentioned somewhere)

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looking at your gems for mm hunters.....what exactly is the haste "softcap" you mention....i cant find these numbers anywhere (though im sure its mentioned somewhere)

at rougly 5% haste you'll be able to fit 5 steadies in between chimera shots, and until you are fully hastecapped that gives better dps than delaying chimera for an extra steadyshot.

(that is, if I'm not mistaken, I haven't been MM since well before 3.0)

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Would a [item]Perfect Shifting Shadow Crystal[/item] be a feasible option until [item]Shifting Twilight Opal[/item] is implemented, you only lose 1 pt ea. agi/stam. I know it is an ugly green gem but the stats that you are looking for are there.

If you are talking about Survival then yes, that would be logical, although at that point you may want to give an [item]Enchanted Tear[/item] a close look. If for MM then no, go for the one of the other options.

As far as the [item]Brilliant Autumn's Glow[/item] goes, I'll add it to the list. They really aren't too bad for yellow options when considering CA (which all pve specs should have), but of course gemming int is a very personal decision. Biggest downfall really is that there isn't an Orange gem with Int for us. An orange gem will always have value over 16 int until you get to sustained durations of Viper time. Perhaps there is a "% of time in Viper" threshold where the Int gem can overtake the Orange options; I don't have a definitive answer on that.

A note on the 3.0.8 patch; haste gems have a lesser value than they do on at live, with more of shot rotations involving instants, to which the benefit of haste is nil. Assuming the accepted rotation involves a 6s instant, a 10s instant and a sting/chimera refresh, crit looks will likely be always better than haste for all specs when considering "yellow" stats. Expect this list to change in accordance with 3.0.8 going live.

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I've just quickly looked over this thread after re-gemming some of my green gems and replacing them with blues.

Were the Armor Penetration gems ([iTEM]40002[/iTEM], [iTEM]40033[/iTEM]) worth me replacing the AP/Stam ones and Agi/Stam?

I'm up to 178 Armor Penetration (11.76% armor avoided, according to stat window) right now, and I can bump it an additional 40 with the Armor Penetration food buff. I have noticed that my hits have been bigger (clothies just crumble before me) but is it worth the loss of additional crit (from Agi) and AP?

At the moment I'm BM 50/21, I used to go Survival for 10 mans (meaning Agi benefits me a little more than just raw AP as that spec) but I think my 10 man group can survive without my Replenishment now which means I can focus on BM.

On that note, would my pet benefit more from the Agi/AP gems as opposed to Armor Penetration?

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Since Blizzard mysteriously decided to make ArP a red stat (and an expensive one at that), and with the change to ArP being a flat percentage reduction (and post -armor debuffs), it is really not viable to gem it. The way ArP worked in TBC, this might have been different, since it effectively scaled on itself, but alas . . . In fact, it is actually going to give you more bang for the buck against higher armored targets than those clothies now, and even decreases in value once Sunders and Farie Fire goes up.

Agility/AP are the best stats you have to gem for your respective spec; ArP simply doesn't compete. You can check that against the spreadsheet, but you are going to be hard-pressed to find any gear situation where ArP can come out ahead. Your pet receives none of that ArP.

Edit: This is now not an accurate comment for many with marksman specs, since 3.1 and past. (original post revised)

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I guessed that on the Pet ArP one, didn't see the stat listed under the pet window.

I guess I'll regem +Agi, in the event I get ninja'd into respeccing Survival again.

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I've just quickly looked over this thread after re-gemming some of my green gems and replacing them with blues.

Were the Armor Penetration gems ([iTEM]40002[/iTEM], [iTEM]40033[/iTEM]) worth me replacing the AP/Stam ones and Agi/Stam?

I'm up to 178 Armor Penetration (11.76% armor avoided, according to stat window) right now, and I can bump it an additional 40 with the Armor Penetration food buff. I have noticed that my hits have been bigger (clothies just crumble before me) but is it worth the loss of additional crit (from Agi) and AP?

At the moment I'm BM 50/21, I used to go Survival for 10 mans (meaning Agi benefits me a little more than just raw AP as that spec) but I think my 10 man group can survive without my Replenishment now which means I can focus on BM.

On that note, would my pet benefit more from the Agi/AP gems as opposed to Armor Penetration?

These are all questions you should answer for yourself with the spreadsheet.

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I think it was MaxDPS that suggested I use ArP. (What a mistake that was)

The spreadsheet was defaulted to Agi I believe, but whilst I was testing that out I found that Marksman did more self buffed DPS than BM.. which I know isn't true because I've seen my 25 man Marksman and BM DPS meters and BM is ahead by a mile. So that's not telling me much.

I think it's just user error in the spreadsheet itself (I'm thinking in the 'rotation' section), but you'd think the thread labeled "WotLK Gem Index" would be the place for gem-related questions (such as 'was gemming ArP a good decision')?

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