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Vrakk

Val'anyr - Hammer of the Ancient Kings

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Total uptime of the buff is going to be very similar for all classes, it's not really a factor. I'm a bit disappointed that the shields only lasts 8 seconds, that alone means that it's going to be quite worthless for raid healing for many encounters. Would be much more attractive if it was 20-30 seconds, right now I feel a bit bad to be collecting the shards instead of a paladin who'd benefit a whole lot more from it.

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Hm, if I understand this correct, glyph-heals will proc while PW:S itself won't. So a 6k PW:S is worth 1200 (20% heal from the glyph) and if the bessing procs, you gain a bubble, which absorbs 15% of that 1200 -> 180? That's still a bad news for disc-priests, while paladins will gain a huge buff regarding the proc chance.

Thanks for the info tho :)

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I'm a bit disappointed that the shields only lasts 8 seconds, that alone means that it's going to be quite worthless for raid healing for many encounters.

Well the duration of the shield is refreshed every time a heal from the mace user is applied, meaning hots will actually provide a shield for a lot more than 8 seconds. Proc may be quite insane in the hands of a 4T8 druid using rejuv / WG for raid healing.

Regarding hots, I have 2 related questions :

  • Do the hots coming from heals casted before the blessing is applied create shields ?
  • Do the hots casted while the blessing is up create shields even after the blessing has vanished ?

I would say yes and no, or no and yes, depending on how the blessing works, I for sure hope it's not no and no :)

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Thanks, I indeed missed a critical sentence

It includes healing done by subsequent ticks of existing hots on the target.

That makes the mace quite powerful regarding tank healing if all hots are up, but reduces the maximal duration of a shield (15 + 8 = 23 seconds, vs almost 45s if a talented regrowth is used under blessing)

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I think some folks are missing the point on the napkin math. Yes you may lose some shield with raid healing. And yes some spells (CoH and CH) may not be as good at keeping the shield up beyond the initial 8 seocnds.

But in reality in a raid dmg fight 8 seconds is a LONG time to go without damage. At leats in Ulduar. Igniss is obviously periodic, and Kolo is more than 8 seconds but from then on pretty much every fight that has raid dmg will eat the shields (your talking 100-1000 for most AOE heal spells).

And that doesnt include the ability to use overheal to max shields during a proc if you know damage is incoming. That will kill your HPM but if it gives you abuffer its worth it in many situations.

I agree that this in the hands of a good pally is an amazing Tank healing tool. But dont discount what a Druid, Holy Priest or Shammie could get out of this.

I really believe that one of these in the hands of a good player will allow you to lower the healing requirements of most fights by at LEAST 1/2 a healer and probably a full healer slot. (Whether I think this is a good thing is a seperate issue). For hard modes like Yogg-0 and Alg this may make the difference between never getting a kill and getting one.

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I think there are a couple of points about raid healing.

1) It'll be a while before a guild gets one of these, let alone two. Are they giving the first one to a raid healer or a tank healer? Pretty likely the latter. If you are waiting on your second hammer for your raid healer to "save half a healer" to get Algalon or Yogg, hard mode, well, you're doing something else wrong.

2) A lot of tiny shields on the raid sounds like it saves healing, but it really doesn't. Anytime you raid heal, there is inherent overheal. Your CoH hits 5 people for 3200 each, e.g., some of them need 2200 healing, some need 3000, whatever. If those tiny shields on your raid came while a damage aura was pulsing, they might mitigate the need for the "nth heal" and be saving the raid healers. But typically, it does't work that way. Instead, someone is CoHing, CHing, PoHing, WGing, whatever and topping people off. Unless the damage is still occurring during that and completely obviates the "nth heal" the proc is well nigh useless in this context.

I'm not saying you don't want the proc; I'm saying you are going to get very much from the proc: You are unlikely to save anyone in imminent danger of death and you are unlikely to actually be able to avoid casting a heal because the shield did your job. It'd have to absorb so much more damage than it does to actually obviate a heal and it'd have to be cast "earlier" -- which of course is impossible until wielding the weapon has a proc that ranodmly shields targets in your raid -- to do that.

We are talking about a shield that will absorb 400-800 damage in most cases in a raid context. And it can only grow if you yourself heals those targets again. If people are still not topped off, however, you will cast another heal to do that, mostly overhealing but necessary. The shielded people will be unlikely to benefit from the shield over the subsequent seconds because the big burst of raid damage is over, etc. And, again, if there's an aura, this is moderately interesting, but things like JoL, iLotP, etc. make it less exciting to absorb say 600 damage when other healing might've covered that anyway.

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As a holy priest, my glyphed CoHs are roughly 21-23k total heals raid buffed, IIRC, but rarely heal over 10k total except on high aoe damage like mimi p2 because of range restrictions and 2-3 resto druids spamming WG at all times. For being such a mana efficient heal, the high overhealing is a real drag and a blessing would be fantastic for making use of the huge heals for a single gcd. And even on things like mimi p2 where it's 0 overhealing because of high raid damage and close radius, obviously being able to put shields on would mitigate tons of damage, and if I've noticed anything from my guild's exploits in Ulduar (still haven't downed Yoggy due to attendance problems) it's raid damage that causes wipes, not tanks dying.

I'd honestly pass it to a resto shaman above all else though.

EDIT:

2) A lot of tiny shields on the raid sounds like it saves healing, but it really doesn't. Anytime you raid heal, there is inherent overheal. Your CoH hits 5 people for 3200 each, e.g., some of them need 2200 healing, some need 3000, whatever. If those tiny shields on your raid came while a damage aura was pulsing, they might mitigate the need for the "nth heal" and be saving the raid healers. But typically, it does't work that way. Instead, someone is CoHing, CHing, PoHing, WGing, whatever and topping people off. Unless the damage is still occurring during that and completely obviates the "nth heal" the proc is well nigh useless in this context.

Targets taking less damage means targets needing less healing which saves your healers mana or means that your smart heals will hit higher priority targets. If people are getting topped off easily through heavy raid damage (think tantrums pre-nerf), then it's a moot point who gets it because you're running too healer-heavy anyway. It saves mana by reducing the need for extra heals, plain and simple, and beyond that it's raid BURST that wipes raids more than sustained raid damage... shields help with burst more than direct heals because you're GCD strained; it's the same philosophy as stacking stam in PvP so you can survive through periods of burst and then top yourself off.

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What we are saying is that the shields that you would get on raid healing are way to small to be noticeable. A disc priest raid healing with PoH can already generate bubbles that are bigger than this mace and which last longer and no-one thinks "wow that's awesome, we must have these microbubbles on the raid to save 1/3 of a cast maybe by some random raid healer" which is what the argument boils down to. PWS is a totally different kettle of fish though. There is real value in spamming this across the raid in high damage situations because it will absorb an order of magnitude more damage, 6-7k vs 600-700.

This is such a small amount of shielding at about 5% of the squishiest raid members life. What kills people in high raid damage situations isn't the fact that they needed another few hundred points in heals, what kills them is that the healers can't output healing to enough targets simultaneously to keep everyone alive. The deaths are normally major overkill in the 3-5k range that require serious healing that the overwhelmed healers couldn't provide either through overload or bad coordination. Think Malygos vortex healing. You got any sort of healing on the target and they would live with 1-2k life. no heals and they probably died.

Finally the low uptime means that you have to assign healing resources so that the worst case scenario is coverable by the healing resources sans proc for those times when the RNG does not favour you.

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A

Targets taking less damage means targets needing less healing which saves your healers mana or means that your smart heals will hit higher priority targets.... It saves mana by reducing the need for extra heals, plain and simple, and beyond that it's raid BURST that wipes raids more than sustained raid damage... shields help with burst more than direct heals because you're GCD strained; it's the same philosophy as stacking stam in PvP so you can survive through periods of burst and then top yourself off.

In theory, these mana savings occur. In reality, I don't think these "extra heals" are being obviated by these tiny shields. We are not talking PW:S size absorbs here. We are talking small bits of absorb. Unless they knock out the need for an entire heal -- like the 3rd or 4th bounch of Chain -- then they aren't saving a heal. Saving 1/3 of a CoH that's being cast anyway? Not that exciting. And therein lies the problem.

And, yes. I get that it could change who is targeted by smart heals. But the presence of the shield won't stop said heals from hitting the lowest people. And the absorb of said shield appears to low to make those people not need any heal.

EDIT: Elly covered most of this; sorry for a bit of redundancy to make the point.

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If you really want true numbers, you need to check out several, different bossfights over the full duration and a clarification if the blessing might be procced by glyphs.
You missed the point of my post. In a theoretical situation, where no heal was 100% over heal, I wanted to see how many "chances to proc" each class would have on average. My numbers were an average over 3 seconds, for example, CoH has a 6 second cooldown and can hit 6 people: an average of 3 "ticks" every 3 seconds. Paladins can easily get 1.5 sec HLs, hence the 2 HLs over 3 seconds, etc. I know that it is better for a Ret/Prot to do JoL, but I was showing that even in a Resto Druid's perfect damage environment (which will never happen), a Paladin could be a close second in the amount of "chances to proc" this mace. I had seen posts saying Druids will have a lot more "chances to proc" so they should get the mace, so I showed that it wasn't true.

I'm a bit disappointed that the shields only lasts 8 seconds, that alone means that it's going to be quite worthless for raid healing for many encounters. Would be much more attractive if it was 20-30 seconds, right now I feel a bit bad to be collecting the shards instead of a paladin who'd benefit a whole lot more from it.
Exactly. Consistent raid damage within 8 seconds is rare in Ulduar, when you actually examine it. Here is a list of encounter comparing the proc on a MT healer to a raid healer:

Razorscale Phase 1: Sporadic and slow raid damage, unlikely to benefit raid healing.

Phase 2: Large benefit to tank healing.

Ignis: Small chance to benefit raid healing during Flame Jet ticks. Large benefit to tank/slag pot healing.

XT: Good for tank healing. Amazing benefit to raid healing (even more amazing benefit to raid healing on hard mode).

Kologarn: Large benefit to tank/stone grip healing. Random raid damage, useful against Arm Sweep.

Iron Council: Very large benefit to tank healing on all three modes. Inconsistent, non-threatening (if people move when they're supposed to) raid damage on easy/medium mode. Would be good on hard mode.

Auriaya: Large benefit to tank healing. Consistent raid damage (unless this is interruptable? I dont remember), would be good here.

Hodir: Large benefit to tank healing. Inconsistent raid damage. During Frozen Blows, would be amazing for both tank and raid healing (if you were lucky enough to get the proc during it).

Thorim: Great for arena and gauntlet event healing. When Thorim jumps down, it would be a very large benefit to tank healing. Even on hard mode, raid damage is large and inconsistent, not a good place for the proc.

Freya: Consistent tank damage and low, random raid damage. Might be good for a raid healer on hard mode, but the damage seemed to be large and bursty?

Mimiron P1: Very large benefit to tank healing. 0 to raid healing.

P2: Amazing benefit to raid healing.

P3: Decent benefit to tank healing. 0 to raid healing.

P4: ~Equal benefit to tank and raid healing.

Vezax: Large benefit to tank healing, inconsistent raid damage. Sounds like it would be very nice for raid healing in hard mode?

Yogg P1: Decent benefit to tank healing.

P2: Random damage, low benefit. Would be a nice proc in the brain room?

P3: Consistent tank damage, inconsistent raid damage.

Algalon: Sounds like a heavy tank damage/movement fight?

Theoretically, the mace would be an overall increase for any healing spec. But, if the shield is not used, should that proc still count as an "increase"? It seems to me the only fights you could guarantee a raid healer's proc and 8 second shield will be used are: XT, hard mode Iron Council, Kologarn, Auriaya, P2/P4 Mimiron, and maybe hard mode Vezax/Freya? Out of those, Kologarn and Auriaya aren't very hard and their raid damage isn't a challenge. Compare that list to fights that the proc and shield will always be a benefit for tank healing... The answer to which class should get the mace seems obvious now, doesn't it?

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So, the proc is a 15% increase to your healing for 15 seconds with a 45 second internal cooldown. So, in a perfect world this proc will start right after cooldown finishes, your every heal will trigger the shield and all and every shield will be fully used. I'll assume that. So, since the proc is once every 1 minute, over time the proc increases your total healing done (including overheal parts) by 15/4 = 3,75%. That, however, is for total healing. If the shields are fully used 100% of the time, it's 0 overheal for them, so we should count how much the proc actually increases your efficient healing.

Last night I overhealed 41%, so efficient healing was 59% of my heals. 59 + 3,75 = 62,75. 62,75/59 = 1,0636, so the actual increase in efficient healing would for me be 6,36%, assuming all shields get used. On paper that looks like a lot. However, if I could choose 1 weapon what Blizzard would send me in in-game mail, it wouldn't be the legendary mace. It would most likely be Staff of Endless Winter. This may sound pretty insane, so I'll explain myself better.

The proc has 15 second duration with 45s internal cooldown. This means the proc is up at maximum 25% of the time. So when the hard part of the encounter comes, it is very likely I will not have the mace proc up. Thus I will need to rely on my existing stats to keep people alive, and thus I will rather take pure stats increase instead of some random +healing proc. I don't want this legendary weapon, because then I would be obligated to wear that mace whats only effect for me would be to nerf my stats.

If this proc was a "Use"-effect with 1 minute cooldown, I would consider it an excellent mace. However, all it requires is 1 failure to cause a wipe during a fight that is many minutes in lenght. Sooner or later it's going to happen that the mace proc isn't up, and if people died then, I would wish that I had picked the weapon with better stats instead of some random, unreliable proc.

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What we are saying is that the shields that you would get on raid healing are way to small to be noticeable. A disc priest raid healing with PoH can already generate bubbles that are bigger than this mace and which last longer and no-one thinks "wow that's awesome, we must have these microbubbles on the raid to save 1/3 of a cast maybe by some random raid healer" which is what the argument boils down to. PWS is a totally different kettle of fish though. There is real value in spamming this across the raid in high damage situations because it will absorb an order of magnitude more damage, 6-7k vs 600-700.

This is such a small amount of shielding at about 5% of the squishiest raid members life. What kills people in high raid damage situations isn't the fact that they needed another few hundred points in heals, what kills them is that the healers can't output healing to enough targets simultaneously to keep everyone alive. The deaths are normally major overkill in the 3-5k range that require serious healing that the overwhelmed healers couldn't provide either through overload or bad coordination. Think Malygos vortex healing. You got any sort of healing on the target and they would live with 1-2k life. no heals and they probably died.

Finally the low uptime means that you have to assign healing resources so that the worst case scenario is coverable by the healing resources sans proc for those times when the RNG does not favour you.

That is absolute and utter nonsense. You are basically arguing that any extra healing is useless since it's not the fact that there is not enough healing, but that is not distributed to people effectively enough that kills people. According to that, all gear upgrades for healers are equally useless.

Small shields add up, take for example any fight with massive raidwide damage, during the 15 seconds of the proc, a good priest or a druid can do around 30-35k hp worth of the small shields on the raid. How often will it save a raidmember from certain death? Not very often. How often do the shields provide extra damage mitigation that doesn't need to be healed? Almost every time.

The napkin math is putting the proc on the mace between 5-10% increased effective healing depending on your class and assignment. That's like going from a blue ilvl 200 weapon to staff of endless winter as far as healing output goes and that's just from the proc.

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Druids do 25 every 3 seconds (18 WG ticks, 3 LB ticks, 3 RJ ticks, 1 from RG).

What you forget here is that a druid will have a lot of rejuv ticking on the whole raid. A druid is generally assigned to raid healing + tank full hoting on heavy tank damage encounters. I usually have around 8-10 rejuv ticking on the raid + regrowth and lb on the tank, with WG up on every cd when raid damage justify it. That means a lot more proc for a druid.

What people tend to forget saying it should go to the tank healer is that even a druid is a tank healer. What druid does not full hot his tank on heavy encounter damage ?

(not counting WG and those number are the ones i have with my Uldu10-25/Naxx25 equipment)

- Rejuv ticking at 2K3 every 3s

- Regrowth ticking at 1k2 every 3s

- LB (3 stacks) ticking at 1k2 every 1s (thus 3k6 every 3s)

We have 3k6 + 1k2 + 2k3 = 7100 / 3 = 2366 * 0.15 = 354 hp /s shield.

Add some 15k nourish 1.5s (gcd) spam when the proc is up, you add a 15k * 0.15 / 1.5s = 1500 /s

You get the maximum shield bonus in 10.8s (20 000 / 1854), not counting the LB blooming for 15k that will probably higly bloom when the shield is building up.

For a paladin (i admit i am not an expert but those are rough numbers of one of the Uldu25/Naxx 25 stuffed paladin in our guild, feel free to correct me).

1.7s = 12k heal (19k crit)

Taking 17k heal to simplify a bit things since paladins are roughly around 60% crit, that means a 17 000 * 0.15 = 2250 shield in 1.7s, therefor a 1323 hp / s shield on the tank.

The shield will be up to full in : 15s.

You can add one holy shoc in the rotation if you want, that will had a 1050hp (7k * 0.15 ) = buff to the shield.

I agree the paladin numbers are not perfect, but the point of my post is to show that on a druid usually assigned to raid + MT healing, it is very good to have, it's not to point that on a paladin it is not.

@Vihermaali, even if the shield are not fully used 100% of the time, it is very good to have. 20% of shield used would mean a 1.27% increase in your total healing. No weapon can give you that just by a few stats. Granted the staff of endless winters has very good stats, but the mace plus a very good offhand isnt that far behind to drop that healing increase.

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That is absolute and utter nonsense. You are basically arguing that any extra healing is useless since it's not the fact that there is not enough healing, but that is not distributed to people effectively enough that kills people. According to that, all gear upgrades for healers are equally useless.

Small shields add up, take for example any fight with massive raidwide damage, during the 15 seconds of the proc, a good priest or a druid can do around 30-35k hp worth of the small shields on the raid. How often will it save a raidmember from certain death? Not very often. How often do the shields provide extra damage mitigation that doesn't need to be healed? Almost every time.

The napkin math is putting the proc on the mace between 5-10% increased effective healing depending on your class and assignment. That's like going from a blue ilvl 200 weapon to staff of endless winter as far as healing output goes and that's just from the proc.

to get 30,000 worth of shielding requires somthing in the order of 200,000 heals in 15 seconds or 13.3k hps This is not something that you can realistically do. Yes spamming PoH and assuming enough haste to get 6 casts in 15 seconds at an average of 7000 x5 x6casts = 210000 healing yes but there are no encounters that require this kind of healing output, not even the old pre nurf deconstructor required this kind or healing output. Note I have not seen the heroics but if you need this kind of output from ONE healer then you are looking at 4 raid healers being required to heal 800,000 points of damage in 15 seconds. Assuming you raid has an average of 25000 health then each raid member is taking 32,000 points of damage each exclusive of tank damage This is about 130% of life required to be healed.

By comparison the raid healing requirement of deconstructor is only about 125,000 in 10 seconds for the raid to survive (at lowish heath) or approximately 1/6 of your example. Assuming 4 raid healers and that more than the bare minimum of healing is output we can assume that each raid healer heals for roughly 40-45K in 15 seconds after the tantrum starts. This represents about 7000 points of healing from bubbles of which not all of it will be used. Anyone can construct theoretical maximum throughput scenarios but lets try to stay within the realm of observed fights. If someone who has seen the hard mode fights could comment on them, how much healing do you realistically put out in any 15 second interval?

As to your comments about healer gear upgrades being useless, actually they pretty much are past a certain minimum level. Because of work hours my raid times are limited and I am routinely undergeared relative to where we are in raid progression. However despite being in low level gear I have never had trouble holding up my end of the healing. For reference I am talking Kara gear mid BT behind the curve gearing here. Healer gear upgrades don't matter that much compared to DPS and tank upgrades and yes most deaths are to do with bad play of one sort or another, the only time gear really proves a factor is when you run out of mana mid fight. Even then the problem is more about regen than throughput. This is even more true now that we cannot downrank so there is no real difference between casting a spell for 6000 of which 1000 is overheal and casting the same spell for 7000 with 2000 overheal.

Finally assuming you have managed to generate 30,000k of bubbles on the raid in your 15 seconds of healing insanity this is still only an average of 1200 points on any one player. These players will still need the follow-up heals they would have recieved without the bubbles as this is less than even a single COH hit. If your healing resources are really that strained that this makes the difference between life and death then you you have bigger issues to worry about. Even assuming you put all this healing onto 5 players your still only talking about a 6k bubble and each player will have been healed for approximately 40,000 points of healing each to generate it.

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Paladins pump holy light at 1.4ish sec, not 1.7. Druids do not crit with Nourish 100% of the time, nor do they have the ability to spam it all the time since refreshing hots takes gcd. Then again, it doesn't take 1.5 sec to cast either.

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to get 30,000 worth of shielding requires somthing in the order of 200,000 heals in 15 seconds or 13.3k hps This is not something that you can realistically do. Yes spamming PoH and assuming enough haste to get 6 casts in 15 seconds at an average of 7000 x5 x6casts = 210000 healing yes but there are no encounters that require this kind of healing output, not even the old pre nurf deconstructor required this kind or healing output. Note I have not seen the heroics but if you need this kind of output from ONE healer then you are looking at 4 raid healers being required to heal 800,000 points of damage in 15 seconds. Assuming you raid has an average of 25000 health then each raid member is taking 32,000 points of damage each exclusive of tank damage This is about 130% of life required to be healed.

For druids it is standard practice to constantly spam 5x rejuve-wild growth on any encounter with significant raiddamage, which gives 15 active rejuvenations and a wild growth at any time. Let's assume the druid can't chain the spells perfectly to 1sec gcd(which you can't in practice) and you don't want to delay wg so let's go with 4x rejuve+wg instead. That gives an active wg and 12 active rejuvenations at any time.

Raw healing from each rejuvenation is 800hp/s per target, 700hp/s per target from wg, wg is active on 6 targets with glyph. Giving us a total of 13.8k hp/s. Most of it is obviously overheal in most encounters but that doesn't matter for the mace proc.

And yes, the shields from mace will probably not be the difference between life and death for anyone. Equally, forgetting to swap back to your healing weapon from Argent Lance is probably not the difference between life and death for anyone. However your overall healing output is affected in both cases.

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You will only get that level of bubbles if you line the ticks up perfectly with the timing of the buff. In reality you will get no more than 4 ticks per rejuve in the 15 second window and assuming as you say that you prioritise WG you will get 14/15 ticks of this lowering your hps converted into bubbles by a significant amount. This is significant as for the purpose of a small finite window like this actual healing done is far more important to calculate than what your theoretical HPS is.

So I think that even for a highly skilled druid you will probably get the following max heal throughput with 800 hps regrowth ticks you tick for 2400. This gives you 12 x 4 x 2400 + 6 x 700 x 14 = 174000 healing actually done in the 15 second window. Because of this your actual healing delivered during the duration of the buff is "only" 11.6k hps. This correlates to a still impressive 26100 in bubbles spread across the raid during the duration of the buff or an average of 1044 points of bubble to each person. This is an impressive healing performance but colour me unimpressed in terms of the value of the bubble.

Note that this is an absolutely best case scenario where no bubbles are wasted. I know of no fights where the entire raid is taking constant damage constantly like this other than sapphiron. My experience of raid healing as Disc with 12 second bubbles is that overhealing by Aegis (ie shield dropping off) is in the 70%+ range and this includes Deconstructor and Ignis.

edit: fixed a dumb maths error

eidt 2, addend Aegis comparison

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Paladins pump holy light at 1.4ish sec, not 1.7. Druids do not crit with Nourish 100% of the time, nor do they have the ability to spam it all the time since refreshing hots takes gcd. Then again, it doesn't take 1.5 sec to cast either.

For nourrish it's not really revelent since nourrish is affected by the GCD thus the real cast time of it is 1.5s. When the proc is up, it's very easy to remove a few rejuv from your raid rotation to pump up the shield.

And as i said, the numbers are not here to show the mace isnt good for a paladin, but to show it is very good for a druid who knows what to do when the proc is up.

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Exactly. Consistent raid damage within 8 seconds is rare in Ulduar, when you actually examine it.

While we can't know for sure, effects like these usually refresh the shield duration when the shield itself is refreshed. This will produce far longer shields than 8 seconds on the raid especially from a resto druid. A wild growth alone would produce a 15s shield, while rejuvenations could produce shields for up to 23 seconds on the raid once a proc happens. I would be surprised if the shield duration isn't refreshed when new healing is added to it.

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For nourrish it's not really revelent since nourrish is affected by the GCD thus the real cast time of it is 1.5s. When the proc is up, it's very easy to remove a few rejuv from your raid rotation to pump up the shield.

And as i said, the numbers are not here to show the mace isnt good for a paladin, but to show it is very good for a druid who knows what to do when the proc is up.

Nourish isn't affected by GotEM, but it is affected by haste on gear and Nature's Grace and so is its gcd. So the casttime is lower than 1.5 even when considering gcd "issues". What I mean with gcds getting in the way, is keeping hots on the MT takes gcds as well, unless you're so lucky that the mace procs right after you've refreshed them all. In the end, I'm saying that it's still better on a paladin for MT healing than for a druid, but your point is valid that it isn't wasted on a druid either.

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In the end, I'm saying that it's still better on a paladin for MT healing than for a druid

I am really not sure of that, he didn't take into account swiftmend either (10k+ HP), neither NS+HT. Druid's HPS on a MT is not very far from paladin's one, if not equal, and the burst healing potential, thus the possibility to make maximum use of the proc, seems much higher to me.

At the end of the day, this proc won't make or break any fight for the simple reason it's a proc, so you cannot be sure to synchronize it with a spike damage, be it on the raid or on the MT. If it procs right before high aoe damage, it'll be nice (the point of a bubble is not really to spare mana btw, it's more to save the player from the next source of damage that is incoming, slow raid wipes happen because healers do not have time to heal everyone, bubbles will be here to give them the little time needed), if it procs right before spike damage on the MT (Unbalancing Strike or similar abilities), it'll be nice, but in no way having a healer with this mace in the raid will allow the raid to take one less raid healer or MT healer. It will on some occasions allow a bit bigger margin of error, be it on raid healing or MT healing, which is already nice for a main hand weapon alone :)

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This correlates to a still impressive 26100 in bubbles spread across the raid during the duration of the buff or an average of 1044 points of bubble to each person. This is an impressive healing performance but colour me unimpressed in terms of the value of the bubble.

Note that this is an absolutely best case scenario where no bubbles are wasted. I know of no fights where the entire raid is taking constant damage constantly like this other than sapphiron.

Well, to replicate the value of the bubble with spellpower would require around 500 additional spellpower, which I would consider significant. Also, this is only if you look at the raw healing. Because of the fact the individual bubbles are so small and get used as people get hit, they are less likely to be wasted.

As for fights with constant raiddamage, Mimiron phase 2 and pretty much every hardmode apart from Vezax and Yogg come to mind.

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So the big schtick of the healer legendary is an uncontrollable clicky trinket proc. It's been mathed out in other places that the proc is worth roughly 80 spellpower when the buff is averaged out over the length of the fight. This is not impressive.

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Just a simple question around the [iTEM]46017[/iTEM] (sorry but I have not still found the answer to it). The person who pick the fragments up is the person who will loot the Val'anyr at the end, right? I mean, it is not possible for a person to pick the fragments and eventually give the Val'anyr to another one, right?

Thank you all :)

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