Infraction: 3. All discussion should be both polite and civil.
Message to User:
You should shut up.
defdef, you are missing the point.
In order for paladins to willingly not spec into the bottom of ret they want something that is BETTER in pvp than what they are giving up. They won't give up the bottom of ret unless the top of holy is even better than what they give up.
The goal of the changes (which falls short spectacularly) is to greatly reduce and weaken paladins in PvP. You do not weaken a class by compensating them for nerfs.
Amera explained this to you already, I am not sure how you can still be failing to understand that if the changes were succesful, then you should see a lot fewer holy paladins at the top of the ratings. They need to cut the number of paladins at the top of the arena ladder by 2/3s.
No, I am seeing your point, you're not seeing mine. Allow me to prove this by regurgitating your point back to you:
You cannot successfully nurf a class that is overpowered by providing buffs to compensate for the nurfs. There, now you cannot accuse me of not understanding your point. Allow me to further break mine down for you.
We can take the simplistic, childish approach to this and say "Paladins are over-represented in arenas because they are overpowered, nurf them!" without actually looking at the facts. We could do that. It is very easy to say "Just start nurfing stuff, it'll work out in the end." or you can ask WHY they are overpowered? What talents, specifically, are causing the issue?
What part of their gameplay is causing problems for teams? Is it mana regen? Is it massive healing output? Is it survivability? Is it control? These questions need asked. You cannot say that Mages are overpowered, and then nurf frost nova and expect to fix the problem if the problem lies with arcane doing massive damage. You have to be more specific.
Therefore, if paladin presence truly is a root cause of ret's control and infinite mana, the solution is to draw paladins AWAY from those things.
Let's look at core paladin strengths.
Control (Hammer, repentance, JoJustice)
Survivability (Plate, SS, HoFreedom breaking stuns, infinite mana)
Healing output (HS, instant FoL, occasional full heals of FoL, rarely HL)
Which do you think people are complaining about? Do you think it is the healing? No, probably not, other classes have this in spades and in cases in greater quantities than paladins. It is by and far, the survivability and control. That is what "makes" the paladin class in arena healing.
Therefore, to summarize: You can safely leave ret alone (thus allowing ret to not further slide down into the dumps of shitty dps spec) and improve DEEP holy, to allow for more paladins to spec into it- thus removing the primary complaints of people that we are the kings of survivability, control, and mana regen.
Tada! That wasn't so hard.
Addressing the root cause of the issue, what a concept.