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Retadin use in raids?


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#2621 flyingtoastr

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Posted 17 October 2007 - 06:48 PM

Seriously guys, this is like reading the Blizzard Forums, not EJ.

Cut out the crap, stop attacking each other, and can we get back to the topic at hand, which is ret pallys in raids? Not whether your pally alt or your holy main knows more about tanking. Take it to PMs or something.

#2622 Fiola

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Posted 17 October 2007 - 06:52 PM

...
I just don't believe that players who don't even raid the first instance of this expansion know a lot about tanking mechanics in raids.

Who raids Ramparts? = )


The impact of the change has very little to do with raid tanking and everything to do with normal instance tanking in pre-raid instances. (for instance, leveling)


Yes, casual paladins who are Ret may have no clue about raid tanking. They're still within their rights to be concerned about how this change may affect their 5-man tanking ability, content which they see and play.


A paladin/druid/warrior can put 20 points in their tanking tree and expect improved tanking competence. Increased AC, increased threat, abilities with strong tanking application. (That you would not personally use such a build is irrelevant - the option is there, and there are hybrid players who utilize this aspect of their minor trees)

With the blanket threat reduction in Fanaticism, minoring in the Prot tree for tanking talents would help little, because the handicap actively reduces tanking (threat gen) ability in all situations, and far beyond what you can regain by speccing iRF.


If that's a sacrifice you're willing to make, you're completely entitled to that opinion - but at least recognize that there is a sacrifice in class ability here, just like no threat reduction talent sacrifices raid DPS ability.

#2623 Katrana

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Posted 17 October 2007 - 07:15 PM

As a non-paladin, I think that the paladin change to threat is very short-sighted. Its a good idea to give paladins threat reduction, but it could be done so much more elegantly.

We often have a ret paladin tanking adds for various bosses (ie at solarian and morogrim). Its nice to have the extra flexibility that allows. The intention should not be to *reduce* the number of tanks available, its already hard enough to find tanks sometimes :(

Someone in my guild mentioned a great idea for getting a guaranteed ret paladin into raids: improved salvation, deep into the ret tree. Would be something you could turn on and off, to help with tanking in a pinch, would also help with aggro issues (although not as much as the inherent 30%). Alternatively, perhaps you could instead package the threat reduction in with sanctity aura.

(if this was already mentioned here, I apologize, its a very long thread though ;-))

#2624 Luxury

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Posted 17 October 2007 - 07:35 PM

I think the ret tanking issue is ridiculously unimportant compared to the more serious issue of raid desirability being essentially unchanged, and possibly slightly worse than it was before. If you as a raid leader find a ret paladin worth bringing after 2.3, chances are you would have found one worth bringing before 2.3 anyway. For certain raids that did the trade-off analysis before 2.3 considering the 3% raid crit, 2.3 may cause them to actually stop bringing a ret due to the loss of the 3% as a uniquely ret addition, and calculating (correctly) that a 15% improvement in personal dps isn't going to offset it.

#2625 Lord BEEF

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Posted 17 October 2007 - 07:41 PM

This coming from someone who once complained that he could only farm 10g an hour as a holy paladin. Pot, kettle, etc.


I just don't believe that players who don't even raid the first instance of this expansion know a lot about tanking mechanics in raids.


As long as we're making ignorant statements based on incomplete Armory information, how does your healbotting make you any more of an expert on raid tanking mechanics?




And that concludes the 66 page thread of "Paladins being dicks to each other and other assorted bitching"

Thank you for choosing the Elitist Jerks forum for your reading enjoyment.




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