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[Cataclysm] Warrior FAQ - 4.2 - Read while patching, before posting.


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#21 Tojas

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 05:21 AM

Something I didn't get about priority as Fury is: When I have a free global (after doing BT>RB>BT), a free Slam via Bloodsurge and Colossus Smash out of cooldown, should I use Colossus Smash or Slam?

Thanks in advice

#22 Macar

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 08:09 AM

I'm not sure that at 85 i agree that spamming execute is the right choice, for certain keep up the 5 stacks for the haste buff, but personally i've not been in a situation where it is the best use of rage = damage. Since there are no hard facts at hand i can't back this up, but i'm pretty sure a lot of other warriors feel the same.


According to Simulationcraft, after you get the 5 stacks, Raging Blow is better than Execute (if you have TG). And of course if you have the excess Rage for it, throw in a Heroic Strike as well.

The same program shows that for SMF, Execute is definately best. A HS here or there on Excess amounts of Rage works well for SMF too though.
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#23 Vorkannis

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Posted 11 January 2011 - 11:52 AM

Something I didn't get about priority as Fury is: When I have a free global (after doing BT>RB>BT), a free Slam via Bloodsurge and Colossus Smash out of cooldown, should I use Colossus Smash or Slam?

Thanks in advice


This is mentioned in the OP if you read between the lines. If Collosus Smash is available, you do not have a free GCD to use a Bloodsurge proc. Use Collosus Smash.

#24 Probaton

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Posted 08 February 2011 - 10:33 AM

Quick fyi: Impending Victory is listed under 'not recommended' in the protection thread but is in the example spec for prot in the general FAQ. I'm assuming prot thread > FAQ (and, to be honest, the talent annoys the crap out of me so I'm skipping it either way) but I figured you might want to correct this in one of these posts.

#25 Lindeman

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Posted 08 February 2011 - 08:09 PM

Regarding Fury; Why do you no longer recommend putting 2 points into Incite and hitting Heroic Strike a bit earlier than 90+ rage? Heroic Strike is getting a 20% damage nerf but it's still our only viable rage dump, right?

#26 Montegomery

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Posted 08 February 2011 - 09:17 PM

Fury no longer stacks Hit as of 4.0.6. Assuming you gear appropriately you will rarely have any rage that needs dumping, and will want to save what rage you have in case you run into a miss streak. As a result you should not be using Heroic Strike often enough for Incite to be a worthwhile talent save in a few high damage fights such as Chimaeron.

It is a DPS increase in such cases and you can still spend the points there if you wish, but in many situations, arguably a large majority, it will do exactly or almost nothing. Temper this with experience however, your rage generation may be enough to warrant it regardless.

... you could very well have a concerto, but the closest the average listener gets to hearing it is the interpretation as put on by a group of small children with those little rainbow-coloured xylophones.


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#27 zork

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Posted 10 February 2011 - 02:57 PM

That is still in question imo. I made two SimulationCrafts depending on the two given BiS lists from http://elitistjerks....ussion_4_0_6_a/.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Set 1: chardev 8 - Cataclysm Beta
Stats: 22% HIT, 20% CRIT, 5.9% HASTE, 11 Mastery, 14,500 AP
DPS: ~26,500 DPS

SimulationCraft HTML output: Simulationcraft Results

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Set 2: chardev 8 - Cataclysm Beta
Stats: 10% HIT, 23.5% CRIT, 5% HASTE, 16.6 Mastery, 14,600 AP
DPS: ~26,600 DPS

SimulationCraft HTML output: Simulationcraft Results

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Both sets deliver nearly the same DPS, just the damage sources are different.

Using hit-stacking will boost your Heroic Strike and white hit dps, while stacking mastery and crit rating (while keeping hit low) will boost your Raging Blow dps. Both turned out nearly even on a Patchwerk-alike encounter.

How this will turn out on moving heavy encounters is uncertain. Low hit setups are dependent on Raging Blow dps which is by itself dependent on the Enrage effect that has to be maintained via Berserker Rage, Deathwish or hits on a mob.
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#28 Montegomery

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Posted 10 February 2011 - 07:07 PM

Your action list isn't up to date with 4.0.6 for the Execute phase. Inner Rage isn't specifically used during that phase anymore due to the change. Raging Blow shouldn't be excluded during that phase either. Execute usage is complicated for low-hit builds as you do not have the rage generation to constantly spam full 30 rage Executes. I'd suggest for the Execute phase that you spam Execute to stack Executioner and then only Execute to maintain the buff, when rage>50-60, or on a Battle Trance proc.

Boss fights with burn phases/damage enhancing phases will greatly favor the low-hit build as its Deathwish cooldown will be significantly more potent. Fights with long interruptions may favor the low-hit build if the interruptions do not delay Death Wish, increasing the proportion of DPS time spent under its effects. Shorter interruptions may be a wash. Fights with significant environmental damage will favor the low-hit build by devaluing the additional rage generation of the high-hit build.

In summary, the majority of non-Patchwerk fights will favor the low-hit build.

... you could very well have a concerto, but the closest the average listener gets to hearing it is the interpretation as put on by a group of small children with those little rainbow-coloured xylophones.


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#29 Baconataur

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Posted 13 February 2011 - 11:49 PM

I read in a lot of places the existence of a difference between TG and SMF's rotations, but nowhere can I actually find what they actually are. Do you think you could post these explicitly in the FAQ?

Thanks

#30 Harlequin719

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Posted 14 February 2011 - 10:50 PM

I read in a lot of places the existence of a difference between TG and SMF's rotations, but nowhere can I actually find what they actually are. Do you think you could post these explicitly in the FAQ?

Thanks


I have been wondering this as well, and based on my own research the main thing that seems to stand out is the prioritization of a Bloodsurge proc'd Slam (SMF) over a Raging Blow (TG) and vice versa.

The two specs seem to operate similarly and I have been playing mine as per the FAQ here, but with taking the instant Slam over RB if they're both up when I am specced SMF. However, I will say that this happens on a rather limited basis in my experience.

#31 Tmender

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 06:51 PM

Q: What are my stat priorities?
A: Get 8% Hit (including Precision), 26 Expertise. SMF prioritizes Strength > Crit > Hit (up to 27%) > Mastery > Haste.

Does this still stand for hit for SMF post 4.06?

#32 Molie

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 03:56 PM

Q: How does Rage generation work now?
A: Only Hit, Haste and Expertise will have an effect.


You still gain rage from a dodged or parried attack, therefore Expertise doesn't have an effect on Rage Generation. Maybe this should be edited, or am i wrong somewhere?

#33 Kuratorn

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Posted 12 March 2011 - 06:55 PM

Expertise effects rage generation in the way that a dodged or parried special attack only costs 4 rage.

Edit:
I meant a dodged or parried Special attack still costs some rage, BT costs 4 rage when dodged / parried.
Sorry for making it unclear.

#34 Molie

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 12:04 AM

Expertise effects rage generation in the way that a dodged or parried attack doesnt give 100% of the rage that you would have gotten if it would have been a hit.


I just tested it, and I gained exactly 29 rage from a melee attack, I also got exactly 29 rage from a parried or dodged melee attack. I was using a 3.6 weapon while being arms, and im 100 % sure about the numbers I got. Feel free to test yourself, because I'm sure that the rage gain is the same as normal hits, even though it's a parry or dodge.

#35 Kethas

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Posted 14 March 2011 - 07:45 AM

I just tested it, and I gained exactly 29 rage from a melee attack, i also got exactly 29 rage from a parried or dodged melee attack. I was using a 3.6 weapon while being arms, and im 100 % sure about the numbers i got. Feel free to test yourself, because im sure that the rage gain is the same as normal hits, even though it's a parry or dodge.


Confirmed. Single-wielding a 3.60 2H mace at 85 as fury against an 88 training dummy I get 23 rage/hit for regular hits, glancing hits, dodges, and parries. 0 rage on a miss. (23 instead of 29 because of the lack of Anger Management.)

Technically expertise still affects rage gain slightly through Flurry, but I think it'd be fair to update the OP to no longer claim that expertise is a major player in rage gen.

#36 Goreskull

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Posted 06 April 2011 - 08:59 PM

I'm having a little trouble understanding the SMF priority. Which is higher priority, Slam procs or Colossus Smash?

Am I correct in understanding the priority as Bloodthirst > Raging Blow > Slam Proc > Colossus Smash?

#37 Dimnerial

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Posted 06 April 2011 - 09:46 PM

Why are one of the options for fury to put in two points into Blood and Thunder? Wouldn't switching from Zerk stance to Battle, throwing up Rend and casting thunderclap be a DPS loss overall?

#38 Montegomery

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Posted 06 April 2011 - 11:40 PM

I'm having a little trouble understanding the SMF priority. Which is higher priority, Slam procs or Colossus Smash?

Am I correct in understanding the priority as Bloodthirst > Raging Blow > Slam Proc > Colossus Smash?


Colossus Smash takes precedence over Slam, and actually over Raging Blow as well. The wording is unclear and warrants an update.

Why are one of the options for fury to put in two points into Blood and Thunder? Wouldn't switching from Zerk stance to Battle, throwing up Rend and casting thunderclap be a DPS loss overall?


For single-target DPS you wouldn't do this, but it's a substantial DPS gain in controlled AoE situations with good execution and stance dancing.

However, the point will be moot in 4.1 with the Whirlwind changes.

... you could very well have a concerto, but the closest the average listener gets to hearing it is the interpretation as put on by a group of small children with those little rainbow-coloured xylophones.


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#39 Goreskull

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Posted 06 April 2011 - 11:57 PM

Colossus Smash takes precedence over Slam, and actually over Raging Blow as well. The wording is unclear and warrants an update.



For single-target DPS you wouldn't do this, but it's a substantial DPS gain in controlled AoE situations with good execution and stance dancing.

However, the point will be moot in 4.1 with the Whirlwind changes.


Thanks for clearing that up. Also do you have an estimation of what the difference in damage is between SMF and TG and what it will be after the patch? I don't see it saying anywhere which is actually the best of the two.

#40 Mordenthal

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Posted 11 April 2011 - 01:19 PM

Excellent FAQ but is it worth considering when to go for socket bonuses?

Ignore and do 40str if socket bonus is haste.
But when it comes down to Mastery and Crit it starts to get a little more blurry.
Any info here would surely help out.




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