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Demonology in Cataclysm (4.3 Release)


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#21 Jmickey

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Posted 14 December 2010 - 01:49 PM

Those logs are certainly quite interesting Wormskull. I am looking forward to seeing some come Cataclysm raiding. I will be sure to keep a close eye on this myself.

I agree that it wouldn't be ideal to recast a dot if the buff is inactive, but I'm not sure what you said is entirely accurate. If damage over time spells are now calculated on each tick, then how why would they have reduced haste for the "entire duration"? Wouldn't the DPS loss apply only for the duration when the Improved Soul Fire buff is not active?


Your assuming the game updates the DoT every tick, which is not the case. When you cast the DoT the haste and crit values are snap shotted (this may also be true for int/sp), and the values do not update until the DoT is refreshed, either through Haunt (for afflic)/HoG/Physical refreshing.

#22 zandelar

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Posted 15 December 2010 - 10:16 AM

One thing you may have missed, and does lots of extra damage and consumes no GCD. Try to time your fel guards Fel Storm ability with your applications of Hand of guldan. Especially if you have more mastery than normal, might help pick up the slack in that elusive haste stat in the starting raid gear.

#23 VoidStar

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Posted 15 December 2010 - 11:56 AM

As long as the targets are standing in the crit aura (which you can maintain with near 100% uptime as the aura lasts 15 seconds and the cooldown on HoGd is 12) there's no need to align your Felstorm casts with your HoGd casts: it's better to use it on cooldown.

#24 Snifu

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Posted 15 December 2010 - 09:56 PM

I have a small question. I know that the talent build in the OP is the optimal personal DPS build and that it assumes that you are fully raid buffs and the enemy are fully raid debuffed.

My question is if you are the only one in your raid who can apply the spell critical strike debuff to the enemy via shadow and flame? Is the 33% chance with one point in the talent enough to ensure decent uptime? If not, what talent would you take points out of (I assume bane), and would you take one or two points out? It seems to me that a 66% chance to apply the debuff would be enough to keep the debuff up without having to ignore molten core procs to keep the debuff up. But that's more of a gut feeling than anything backed up by math.

#25 blasfem

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Posted 16 December 2010 - 10:16 PM

Question regarding use of Incenerate as nuke vs. Shadowbolt.
Is it possible for Inninerate to be overall dps increase considering these factors:

You can spec 3/3 Shadow and Flame - a 8% dps increase to Incinerate

Even with 3/3 bane. Incinerate is at least 10% faster cast than SB, theoretically that's 10% or more off Meta couldown


Just wondering the actual sim numbers on

3/3 Bane - 1/3 Shadow and Flame (SB nuke)
vs
1/3 Bane - 3/3 Shadow and Flame (Incin nuke)

Also, if going the latter route, you might be able to forgo Bane entirely and just point a point into Life Tap
to partially make up for the mana differential on Incin and SB

#26 ~Thalia~

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Posted 16 December 2010 - 11:23 PM

Question regarding use of Incenerate as nuke vs. Shadowbolt.
Is it possible for Inninerate to be overall dps increase considering these factors:

You can spec 3/3 Shadow and Flame - a 8% dps increase to Incinerate

Even with 3/3 bane. Incinerate is at least 10% faster cast than SB, theoretically that's 10% or more off Meta couldown


Just wondering the actual sim numbers on

3/3 Bane - 1/3 Shadow and Flame (SB nuke)
vs
1/3 Bane - 3/3 Shadow and Flame (Incin nuke)

Also, if going the latter route, you might be able to forgo Bane entirely and just point a point into Life Tap
to partially make up for the mana differential on Incin and SB

You're overlooking the base spell coefficients, SB scaling better with gear than Incinerate due to its longer cast time.
That and the fact that if you're using Incinerate as a filler, you're essentially wasting 1 MC proc out of 3, because if you're casting Incinerate when MC procs, the cast time isn't updated while you're still consuming a stack.

SB is intended to be Demonology's filler.

Edit : I did simulated the talent builds you suggested. Here are the results (using my toon and gear)

Posted Image

SB is the standard profile.
Inc is using Bane 1/3 and S&F 3/3
IncNoBane is using S&F 3/3 and Imp LT 1/2

DPS Ranking:
  52690 100.0%  Raid
  17771  33.7%  thaliÃ*_SB
  17509  33.2%  thaliÃ*_Inc
  17454  33.1%  thaliÃ*_IncNoBane

Player: thaliÃ*_Inc gnome warlock demonology 85
  DPS: 17509.1  Error=11.3/0.1%  Range=1602/9.1%  DPR=9.7  RPS-Out=1812.2 RPS-In=1572.2  Resource=(mana) Waiting=0.0 ApM=48.2
  Origin: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/marecage-de-zangar/thali%C3%A0/advanced
  Talents: http://fr.wowhead.com/talent#IZfrrf0uMRdosrb
  Core Stats:  strength=640|61(0)  agility=655|75(0)  stamina=5993|4987(4565)  intellect=4182|3574(3229)  spirit=175|175(0)  mastery=13.65|13.65(1013)  health=96924|87874  mana=80380|77576
  Spell Stats:  power=7193|5293(1729)  hit=17.20%|17.20%(1762)  crit=18.54%|12.60%(967)  penetration=0|0(0)  haste=18.32%|9.40%(1204)  mp5=1027|1027(0)
  Attack Stats  power=1399|112(0)  hit=14.67%|14.67%(1762)  crit=16.34%|8.40%(967)  expertise=0.00|0.00(0)  haste=9.40%|9.40%(1204)
  Defense Stats:  armor=7363|7363(7363)  blockv=320|31(0)  miss=4.70%|4.70%  dodge=3.89%|1.98%(0)  parry=0.00%|0.00%(0)  block=0.00%|0.00%(0) crit=5.90%|5.90%
  Glyphs: immolate/metamorphosis/incinerate/corruption/fear/soul_link/ritual_of_souls/drain_soul/unending_breath
  Priorities:
    flask,type=draconic_mind/food,type=seafood_magnifique_feast/fel_armor
    summon_felguard/dark_intent/snapshot_stats/use_item,name=flamebloom_gloves
    volcanic_potion,if=buff.bloodlust.react|!in_combat/demon_soul
    hand_of_guldan,if=dot.immolate.remains>(cast_time+travel_time)
    immolate,if=dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time&buff.improved_soul_fire.remains>cast_time&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    soulburn,if=buff.metamorphosis.up&buff.bloodlust.down
    soul_fire,if=buff.improved_soul_fire.cooldown_remains<(cast_time+travel_time)&buff.bloodlust.down&!in_flight
    metamorphosis
    immolate,if=(dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    bane_of_doom,if=(remains<3|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=15&miss_react
    immolation,if=buff.metamorphosis.remains>10
    corruption,if=(!ticking|dot.corruption.remains<tick_time)&miss_react/shadowflame
    hand_of_guldan/incinerate,if=buff.molten_core.react
    soul_fire,if=buff.decimation.react/summon_infernal/life_tap,mana_percentage<=35
    incinerate/life_tap
  Actions:
    bane_of_doom        Count=  6.0|49.61sec  DPE= 59094| 7%  DPET= 54987  DPR=  19.2  pDPS=1190  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=19  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=15616|10801|26740  CritTick=32162|22195|54947|18.8%
    corruption          Count= 18.8|16.00sec  DPE= 24087| 9%  DPET= 21826  DPR=  19.5  pDPS=1513  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=135  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=2683|2010|5296  CritTick=5528|4130|10883|23.7%
    hand_of_guldan      Count= 21.2|14.25sec  DPE= 17487| 7%  DPET= 11910  DPR=  12.2  pDPS=1236  Miss=0.00%  Hit=13970|11086|25623  Crit=28803|22780|52651|23.7%
    immolate            Count= 19.7|15.28sec  DPE= 41784|16%  DPET= 29823  DPR=  25.4  pDPS=2742  Miss=0.00%  Hit=4532|3521|8455  Crit= 9320| 7234|17374|23.6%  TickCount=139  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4072|3121|7671  CritTick=8386|6413|15762|23.7%
    immolation_aura     Count=  3.1|103.78sec  DPE= 72011| 4%  DPET= 66556  DPR=   5.5  pDPS= 750  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=66  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3397|2873|4794
    incinerate          Count= 68.1| 3.93sec  DPE= 11774|15%  DPET=  7813  DPR=   4.1  pDPS=2674  Miss=0.00%  Hit=9417|6936|21188  Crit=19354|14252|43539|23.7%
    infernal_awakening  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 21010| 0%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=  70  Miss=0.00%  Hit=16788|10942|17872  Crit=34403|22485|36724|24.0%
    shadowflame         Count= 20.9|14.34sec  DPE= 19203| 8%  DPET= 17430  DPR=   3.7  pDPS=1337  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2370|1871|4056  Crit= 4879| 3844| 8334|23.6%  TickCount=88  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3088|2278|6010  CritTick=6360|4681|12349|23.7%
    soul_fire           Count= 41.1| 7.38sec  DPE= 14789|12%  DPET=  9625  DPR=   8.0  pDPS=2025  Miss=0.00%  Hit=11825|9087|21214  Crit=24293|18673|43591|23.8%
   felguard  (DPS=2903.3)
    felstorm            Count=  7.0|45.00sec  DPE= 40819|33%  DPET=     1  DPR= 125.0  pDPS= 954  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=49  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4773|4434|6586  CritTick=9472|8868|13173|22.5%
    legion_strike       Count= 50.5| 6.00sec  DPE=  2851|17%  DPET=  1855  DPR=   2.5  pDPS= 480  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2305|2173|3020  Crit= 4614| 4345| 6039|23.6%
    melee               Count=187.2| 1.60sec  DPE=  2351|51%  DPET=  1471  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1469  Miss=0.00%  Hit=1998|1876|2600  Crit= 3995| 3751| 5200|23.7%  Glance=1498|24.0%
   infernal  (DPS=2563.9)
    infernal_immolation  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 55723|29%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 747  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=32  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=1741|1600|2417
    infernal_melee      Count= 78.0| 0.82sec  DPE=  1737|71%  DPET=  1045  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1817  Miss=7.99%  Hit=1683|1617|2007  Crit= 3370| 3233| 4013|23.7%  Glance=1263|24.0%  Dodge=6.5%
   ebon_imp  (DPS=453.3)
    ebon_imp_melee      Count=156.8| 0.83sec  DPE=   828|100%  DPET=   498  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 453  Miss=8.05%  Hit= 801| 801| 801  Crit= 1602| 1602| 1602|23.9%  Glance= 601|24.0%  Dodge=6.5%
  Constant Buffs: arcane_brilliance/blessing_of_kings/blessing_of_might/blessing_of_might_regen/dark_intent
  Constant Buffs: dark_intent_feedback/fel_armor/fortitude/replenishment
  Dynamic Buffs:
    anhuurs_hymnal         : start=5.5  refresh=0.0   interval= 57.4 trigger=57.4  uptime=18%
    bloodlust              : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit= 1%
    decimation             : start=1.0  refresh=31.0  interval= 56.5 trigger=1.9   uptime=20%  benefit=36%
    demon_soul_felguard    : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=120.7 trigger=120.7 uptime=20%  benefit=25%
    hand_of_guldan         : start=3.8  refresh=17.3  interval= 45.5 trigger=14.3  uptime=98%  benefit=97%
    improved_soul_fire     : start=16.9 refresh=0.0   interval= 18.1 trigger=18.1  uptime=80%  benefit=75%
    metamorphosis          : start=3.1  refresh=0.0   interval=105.3 trigger=105.3 uptime=37%  benefit=51%
    molten_core            : start=7.1  refresh=1.2   interval= 37.4 trigger=31.2  uptime=17%  benefit=30%
    shadow_trance          : start=4.6  refresh=0.8   interval= 53.0 trigger=43.3  uptime=16%
    sorrowsong             : start=4.2  refresh=0.0   interval= 24.2 trigger=24.2  uptime=13%
    soulburn               : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=106.4 trigger=106.4 uptime= 8%  benefit= 6%
    synapse_springs        : start=5.3  refresh=0.0   interval= 60.7 trigger=60.7  uptime=20%
    volcanic_potion        : start=2.0  refresh=0.0   interval=238.3 trigger=238.3 uptime=15%
    felguard-bloodlust     : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit=16%
    infernal-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
    ebon_imp-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
  Up-Times:
    100.0% : backdraft_0                   
  Procs:
      9.5 |  28.51sec : ebon_imp
     13.3 |  19.47sec : impending_doom
      5.4 |  43.30sec : shadow_trance
  Gains:
     19397.9 : blessing_of_might
     80379.6 : initial_mana     
    328919.0 : life_tap         
     37959.8 : mana_feed          (overflow=1.1%)
     61100.3 : mp5_regen        
     23910.5 : replenishment    
  Pet "felguard" Gains:
    45906.3 : initial_mana     
     4583.8 : mana_feed          (overflow=97.7%)
     3281.8 : mana_spring_totem  (overflow=83.2%)
    49442.3 : mp5_regen          (overflow=72.2%)
     2472.8 : replenishment      (overflow=83.2%)
  Scale Factors:
    Weights :  Sta=0.0000  Int=0.0000  SP=0.0000  Hit=0.0000  Crit=0.0000  Haste=0.0000  Mastery=0.0000
    Wowhead : 
  DPS Plot Data ( min=-200.0 max=200.0 points=21 )

Player: thaliÃ*_IncNoBane gnome warlock demonology 85
  DPS: 17453.7  Error=11.3/0.1%  Range=1541/8.8%  DPR=9.7  RPS-Out=1805.7 RPS-In=1565.5  Resource=(mana) Waiting=0.0 ApM=48.0
  Origin: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/marecage-de-zangar/thali%C3%A0/advanced
  Talents: http://fr.wowhead.com/talent#IzZfrrf0uMRdocrb
  Core Stats:  strength=640|61(0)  agility=655|75(0)  stamina=5993|4987(4565)  intellect=4182|3574(3229)  spirit=175|175(0)  mastery=13.65|13.65(1013)  health=96924|87874  mana=80380|77576
  Spell Stats:  power=7193|5293(1729)  hit=17.20%|17.20%(1762)  crit=18.54%|12.60%(967)  penetration=0|0(0)  haste=18.32%|9.40%(1204)  mp5=1027|1027(0)
  Attack Stats  power=1399|112(0)  hit=14.67%|14.67%(1762)  crit=16.34%|8.40%(967)  expertise=0.00|0.00(0)  haste=9.40%|9.40%(1204)
  Defense Stats:  armor=7363|7363(7363)  blockv=320|31(0)  miss=4.70%|4.70%  dodge=3.89%|1.98%(0)  parry=0.00%|0.00%(0)  block=0.00%|0.00%(0) crit=5.90%|5.90%
  Glyphs: immolate/metamorphosis/incinerate/corruption/fear/soul_link/ritual_of_souls/drain_soul/unending_breath
  Priorities:
    flask,type=draconic_mind/food,type=seafood_magnifique_feast/fel_armor
    summon_felguard/dark_intent/snapshot_stats/use_item,name=flamebloom_gloves
    volcanic_potion,if=buff.bloodlust.react|!in_combat/demon_soul
    hand_of_guldan,if=dot.immolate.remains>(cast_time+travel_time)
    immolate,if=dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time&buff.improved_soul_fire.remains>cast_time&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    soulburn,if=buff.metamorphosis.up&buff.bloodlust.down
    soul_fire,if=buff.improved_soul_fire.cooldown_remains<(cast_time+travel_time)&buff.bloodlust.down&!in_flight
    metamorphosis
    immolate,if=(dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    bane_of_doom,if=(remains<3|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=15&miss_react
    immolation,if=buff.metamorphosis.remains>10
    corruption,if=(!ticking|dot.corruption.remains<tick_time)&miss_react/shadowflame
    hand_of_guldan/incinerate,if=buff.molten_core.react
    soul_fire,if=buff.decimation.react/summon_infernal/life_tap,mana_percentage<=35
    incinerate/life_tap
  Actions:
    bane_of_doom        Count=  6.1|48.28sec  DPE= 57931| 7%  DPET= 53572  DPR=  18.8  pDPS=1174  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=19  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=15369|10801|26740  CritTick=31696|22195|54947|18.9%
    corruption          Count= 18.8|16.04sec  DPE= 23921| 9%  DPET= 21642  DPR=  19.4  pDPS=1500  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=135  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=2671|2010|5296  CritTick=5501|4130|10883|23.7%
    hand_of_guldan      Count= 21.3|14.15sec  DPE= 17527| 7%  DPET= 11969  DPR=  12.2  pDPS=1247  Miss=0.00%  Hit=14016|11086|25623  Crit=28809|22780|52651|23.7%
    immolate            Count= 20.0|14.99sec  DPE= 41231|16%  DPET= 28091  DPR=  25.1  pDPS=2754  Miss=0.00%  Hit=4514|3521|8455  Crit= 9290| 7234|17374|23.8%  TickCount=140  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4082|3121|7671  CritTick=8396|6413|15762|23.7%
    immolation_aura     Count=  3.1|103.81sec  DPE= 72062| 4%  DPET= 66716  DPR=   5.5  pDPS= 751  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=66  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3395|2873|4794
    incinerate          Count= 67.2| 3.98sec  DPE= 11838|15%  DPET=  7877  DPR=   4.1  pDPS=2653  Miss=0.00%  Hit=9473|6936|21188  Crit=19475|14252|43539|23.6%
    infernal_awakening  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 20990| 0%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=  70  Miss=0.00%  Hit=16771|10942|17872  Crit=34226|22485|36724|24.2%
    shadowflame         Count= 21.0|14.25sec  DPE= 19066| 8%  DPET= 17289  DPR=   3.7  pDPS=1333  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2361|1871|4056  Crit= 4861| 3844| 8334|23.9%  TickCount=88  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3075|2278|6010  CritTick=6326|4681|12349|23.6%
    soul_fire           Count= 40.7| 7.46sec  DPE= 14696|11%  DPET=  9542  DPR=   7.9  pDPS=1993  Miss=0.00%  Hit=11741|9087|21214  Crit=24155|18673|43591|23.8%
   felguard  (DPS=2905.8)
    felstorm            Count=  7.0|45.00sec  DPE= 40883|33%  DPET=     1  DPR= 125.2  pDPS= 955  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=49  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4772|4434|6586  CritTick=9475|8868|13173|22.7%
    legion_strike       Count= 50.5| 6.00sec  DPE=  2850|17%  DPET=  1854  DPR=   2.5  pDPS= 480  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2305|2173|3020  Crit= 4612| 4345| 6039|23.6%
    melee               Count=187.2| 1.60sec  DPE=  2353|51%  DPET=  1472  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1470  Miss=0.00%  Hit=1998|1876|2600  Crit= 3995| 3751| 5200|23.8%  Glance=1498|24.0%
   infernal  (DPS=2565.9)
    infernal_immolation  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 55725|29%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 746  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=32  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=1741|1600|2417
    infernal_melee      Count= 78.0| 0.82sec  DPE=  1742|71%  DPET=  1048  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1820  Miss=7.98%  Hit=1684|1617|2007  Crit= 3369| 3233| 4013|23.9%  Glance=1263|23.9%  Dodge=6.5%
   ebon_imp  (DPS=456.6)
    ebon_imp_melee      Count=157.7| 0.83sec  DPE=   828|100%  DPET=   498  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 457  Miss=8.03%  Hit= 801| 801| 801  Crit= 1602| 1602| 1602|23.8%  Glance= 601|24.1%  Dodge=6.5%
  Constant Buffs: arcane_brilliance/blessing_of_kings/blessing_of_might/blessing_of_might_regen/dark_intent
  Constant Buffs: dark_intent_feedback/fel_armor/fortitude/replenishment
  Dynamic Buffs:
    anhuurs_hymnal         : start=5.5  refresh=0.0   interval= 57.5 trigger=57.5  uptime=18%
    bloodlust              : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit= 1%
    decimation             : start=1.0  refresh=30.7  interval= 54.4 trigger=1.9   uptime=20%  benefit=36%
    demon_soul_felguard    : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=120.7 trigger=120.7 uptime=20%  benefit=25%
    hand_of_guldan         : start=2.4  refresh=18.9  interval= 78.6 trigger=14.1  uptime=98%  benefit=98%
    improved_soul_fire     : start=16.9 refresh=0.0   interval= 18.2 trigger=18.2  uptime=80%  benefit=75%
    metamorphosis          : start=3.2  refresh=0.0   interval=105.3 trigger=105.3 uptime=37%  benefit=51%
    molten_core            : start=7.1  refresh=1.3   interval= 37.3 trigger=31.0  uptime=17%  benefit=31%
    shadow_trance          : start=4.6  refresh=0.8   interval= 53.0 trigger=43.4  uptime=16%
    sorrowsong             : start=4.2  refresh=0.0   interval= 24.1 trigger=24.1  uptime=13%
    soulburn               : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=106.5 trigger=106.5 uptime= 8%  benefit= 6%
    synapse_springs        : start=5.3  refresh=0.0   interval= 60.6 trigger=60.6  uptime=20%
    volcanic_potion        : start=2.0  refresh=0.0   interval=238.3 trigger=238.3 uptime=15%
    felguard-bloodlust     : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit=16%
    infernal-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
    ebon_imp-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
  Up-Times:
    100.0% : backdraft_0                   
  Procs:
      9.5 |  28.33sec : ebon_imp
     13.3 |  19.47sec : impending_doom
      5.4 |  43.38sec : shadow_trance
  Gains:
     19397.9 : blessing_of_might
     80379.6 : initial_mana     
    326968.5 : life_tap         
     37895.1 : mana_feed          (overflow=1.1%)
     61100.3 : mp5_regen        
     23910.5 : replenishment    
  Pet "felguard" Gains:
    45906.3 : initial_mana     
     4777.8 : mana_feed          (overflow=97.6%)
     3271.6 : mana_spring_totem  (overflow=83.2%)
    49267.1 : mp5_regen          (overflow=72.3%)
     2465.1 : replenishment      (overflow=83.2%)
  Scale Factors:
    Weights :  Sta=0.0000  Int=0.0000  SP=0.0000  Hit=0.0000  Crit=0.0000  Haste=0.0000  Mastery=0.0000
    Wowhead : 
  DPS Plot Data ( min=-200.0 max=200.0 points=21 )

Player: thaliÃ*_SB gnome warlock demonology 85
  DPS: 17770.5  Error=11.3/0.1%  Range=1774/10.0%  DPR=10.8  RPS-Out=1641.1 RPS-In=1401.1  Resource=(mana) Waiting=0.0 ApM=47.8
  Origin: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/marecage-de-zangar/thali%C3%A0/advanced
  Talents: http://fr.wowhead.com/talent#IZfrrf0uMRdourb
  Core Stats:  strength=640|61(0)  agility=655|75(0)  stamina=5993|4987(4565)  intellect=4182|3574(3229)  spirit=175|175(0)  mastery=13.65|13.65(1013)  health=96924|87874  mana=80380|77576
  Spell Stats:  power=7193|5293(1729)  hit=17.20%|17.20%(1762)  crit=18.54%|12.60%(967)  penetration=0|0(0)  haste=18.32%|9.40%(1204)  mp5=1027|1027(0)
  Attack Stats  power=1399|112(0)  hit=14.67%|14.67%(1762)  crit=16.34%|8.40%(967)  expertise=0.00|0.00(0)  haste=9.40%|9.40%(1204)
  Defense Stats:  armor=7363|7363(7363)  blockv=320|31(0)  miss=4.70%|4.70%  dodge=3.89%|1.98%(0)  parry=0.00%|0.00%(0)  block=0.00%|0.00%(0) crit=5.90%|5.90%
  Glyphs: immolate/metamorphosis/incinerate/shadow_bolt/fear/soul_link/ritual_of_souls/drain_soul/unending_breath
  Priorities:
    flask,type=draconic_mind/food,type=seafood_magnifique_feast/fel_armor
    summon_felguard/dark_intent/snapshot_stats/use_item,name=flamebloom_gloves
    volcanic_potion,if=buff.bloodlust.react|!in_combat/demon_soul
    hand_of_guldan,if=dot.immolate.remains>(cast_time+travel_time)
    immolate,if=dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time&buff.improved_soul_fire.remains>cast_time&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    soulburn,if=buff.metamorphosis.up&buff.bloodlust.down
    soul_fire,if=buff.improved_soul_fire.cooldown_remains<(cast_time+travel_time)&buff.bloodlust.down&!in_flight
    metamorphosis
    immolate,if=(dot.immolate.remains<cast_time+tick_time|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=4&miss_react
    bane_of_doom,if=(remains<3|!ticking)&target.time_to_die>=15&miss_react
    immolation,if=buff.metamorphosis.remains>10
    corruption,if=(!ticking|dot.corruption.remains<tick_time)&miss_react/shadowflame
    hand_of_guldan/incinerate,if=buff.molten_core.react
    soul_fire,if=buff.decimation.react/summon_infernal/life_tap,mana_percentage<=35
    shadow_bolt/life_tap
  Actions:
    bane_of_doom        Count=  6.1|47.77sec  DPE= 57363| 7%  DPET= 52686  DPR=  18.6  pDPS=1168  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=19  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=15269|10801|26740  CritTick=31473|22195|54947|18.9%
    corruption          Count= 18.8|16.08sec  DPE= 24127| 8%  DPET= 21696  DPR=  19.6  pDPS=1510  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=134  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=2700|2010|5296  CritTick=5556|4130|10883|23.7%
    hand_of_guldan      Count= 21.3|14.18sec  DPE= 17569| 7%  DPET= 12013  DPR=  12.2  pDPS=1249  Miss=0.00%  Hit=14032|11086|25623  Crit=28912|22780|52651|23.8%
    immolate            Count= 20.2|14.83sec  DPE= 41002|16%  DPET= 36665  DPR=  24.9  pDPS=2767  Miss=0.00%  Hit=4527|3521|8455  Crit= 9323| 7234|17374|23.6%  TickCount=140  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4090|3121|7671  CritTick=8420|6413|15762|23.7%
    immolation_aura     Count=  3.1|103.61sec  DPE= 72119| 4%  DPET= 66522  DPR=   5.5  pDPS= 753  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=66  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3406|2873|4794
    incinerate          Count= 21.7|11.02sec  DPE= 12360| 5%  DPET= 10682  DPR=   4.3  pDPS= 895  Miss=0.00%  Hit=9875|7445|19675  Crit=20319|15616|40429|23.8%
    infernal_awakening  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 21032| 0%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=  70  Miss=0.00%  Hit=16803|10942|17872  Crit=34610|22485|36724|23.8%
    shadow_bolt         Count= 46.5| 4.95sec  DPE= 13153|11%  DPET=  7185  DPR=   7.5  pDPS=2040  Miss=0.00%  Hit=10520|8170|21580  Crit=21627|16788|44344|23.7%
    shadowflame         Count= 20.7|14.44sec  DPE= 19159| 7%  DPET= 17256  DPR=   3.7  pDPS=1325  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2369|1871|4056  Crit= 4862| 3844| 8334|23.8%  TickCount=87  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=3083|2278|6010  CritTick=6355|4681|12349|23.7%
    soul_fire           Count= 41.2| 7.36sec  DPE= 14634|11%  DPET=  9529  DPR=   7.9  pDPS=2011  Miss=0.00%  Hit=11701|9087|21214  Crit=24113|18673|43591|23.6%
   felguard  (DPS=2906.8)
    felstorm            Count=  7.0|45.00sec  DPE= 40926|33%  DPET=     1  DPR= 125.3  pDPS= 956  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=49  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=4777|4434|6586  CritTick=9484|8868|13173|22.7%
    legion_strike       Count= 50.5| 6.00sec  DPE=  2849|17%  DPET=  1854  DPR=   2.5  pDPS= 480  Miss=0.00%  Hit=2304|2173|3020  Crit= 4614| 4345| 6039|23.6%
    melee               Count=187.2| 1.60sec  DPE=  2353|51%  DPET=  1472  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1470  Miss=0.00%  Hit=1998|1876|2600  Crit= 3995| 3751| 5200|23.8%  Glance=1499|24.0%
   infernal  (DPS=2581.0)
    infernal_immolation  Count=  1.0| 0.00sec  DPE= 55730|29%  DPET=     1  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 750  Miss=0.00%  TickCount=32  MissTick=0.0%  Tick=1742|1600|2417
    infernal_melee      Count= 78.0| 0.82sec  DPE=  1744|71%  DPET=  1049  DPR=   0.0  pDPS=1831  Miss=7.94%  Hit=1684|1617|2007  Crit= 3369| 3233| 4013|24.0%  Glance=1263|24.1%  Dodge=6.5%
   ebon_imp  (DPS=457.0)
    ebon_imp_melee      Count=158.2| 0.83sec  DPE=   828|100%  DPET=   498  DPR=   0.0  pDPS= 457  Miss=8.00%  Hit= 801| 801| 801  Crit= 1602| 1602| 1602|23.9%  Glance= 601|24.0%  Dodge=6.5%
  Constant Buffs: arcane_brilliance/blessing_of_kings/blessing_of_might/blessing_of_might_regen/dark_intent
  Constant Buffs: dark_intent_feedback/fel_armor/fortitude/replenishment
  Dynamic Buffs:
    anhuurs_hymnal         : start=5.6  refresh=0.0   interval= 57.4 trigger=57.4  uptime=18%
    bloodlust              : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit= 1%
    decimation             : start=1.0  refresh=31.5  interval= 53.5 trigger=1.9   uptime=20%  benefit=37%
    demon_soul_felguard    : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=120.7 trigger=120.7 uptime=20%  benefit=25%
    hand_of_guldan         : start=2.7  refresh=18.6  interval= 87.5 trigger=14.2  uptime=98%  benefit=98%
    improved_soul_fire     : start=16.8 refresh=0.0   interval= 18.2 trigger=18.2  uptime=79%  benefit=75%
    metamorphosis          : start=3.2  refresh=0.0   interval=105.0 trigger=105.0 uptime=37%  benefit=51%
    molten_core            : start=7.0  refresh=1.4   interval= 38.1 trigger=30.9  uptime=19%  benefit=100%
    sorrowsong             : start=4.2  refresh=0.0   interval= 24.2 trigger=24.2  uptime=13%
    soulburn               : start=3.0  refresh=0.0   interval=106.2 trigger=106.2 uptime= 8%  benefit= 6%
    synapse_springs        : start=5.3  refresh=0.0   interval= 60.7 trigger=60.7  uptime=20%
    volcanic_potion        : start=2.0  refresh=0.0   interval=238.3 trigger=238.3 uptime=15%
    felguard-bloodlust     : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime=13%  benefit=16%
    infernal-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
    ebon_imp-replenishment : start=1.0  refresh=0.0   interval=  0.0 trigger=0.0   uptime= 0%
  Up-Times:
    100.0% : backdraft_0                   
  Procs:
      9.6 |  28.29sec : ebon_imp
     13.5 |  19.22sec : impending_doom
  Gains:
     19397.9 : blessing_of_might
     80379.6 : initial_mana     
    277701.8 : life_tap         
     37873.9 : mana_feed          (overflow=1.1%)
     61100.3 : mp5_regen        
     23910.5 : replenishment    
  Pet "felguard" Gains:
    45906.3 : initial_mana     
     4196.1 : mana_feed          (overflow=97.5%)
     3288.9 : mana_spring_totem  (overflow=83.2%)
    49819.1 : mp5_regen          (overflow=72.0%)
     2478.1 : replenishment      (overflow=83.2%)
  Scale Factors:
    Weights :  Sta=0.0000  Int=0.0000  SP=0.0000  Hit=0.0000  Crit=0.0000  Haste=0.0000  Mastery=0.0000
    Wowhead : 
  DPS Plot Data ( min=-200.0 max=200.0 points=21 )

Auras and De-Buffs:
  Constant: Demonic Pact/bleeding/blood_frenzy_physical/communion/critical_mass/earth_and_moon/hunters_mark
  Constant: leader_of_the_pack/mana_spring_totem/mangle/poisoned/strength_of_earth/sunder_armor/thunder_clap
  Constant: windfury_totem/wrath_of_air
  Dynamic:

Waiting:
    All players active 100% of the time.

Baseline Performance:
  TotalEvents   = 104329020
  MaxEventQueue = 81
  TargetHealth  = 15770225
  SimSeconds    = 3000131
  CpuSeconds    = 77.606
  SpeedUp       = 38658

RNG global Actual/Expected Roll=0.999602 Range=1.000000 Gauss=0.999951


#27 Jmickey

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Posted 17 December 2010 - 06:21 AM

I have a small question. I know that the talent build in the OP is the optimal personal DPS build and that it assumes that you are fully raid buffs and the enemy are fully raid debuffed.

My question is if you are the only one in your raid who can apply the spell critical strike debuff to the enemy via shadow and flame? Is the 33% chance with one point in the talent enough to ensure decent uptime? If not, what talent would you take points out of (I assume bane), and would you take one or two points out? It seems to me that a 66% chance to apply the debuff would be enough to keep the debuff up without having to ignore molten core procs to keep the debuff up. But that's more of a gut feeling than anything backed up by math.


Getting the initial buff up will be a tad difficult, but onces it is up, keeping it up should not be hard with 1/3 SnF. You have 30 seconds to refresh it which is a fair few shadow bolts, even with MC procs, DoT refreshing etc.

If your hell bent on putting another point in, you would need to Sim it to be sure where it is best to take out the point, but either Bane or possibly Emberstorm would be best, but that is just speculation.

#28 mierin

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Posted 17 December 2010 - 07:31 PM

I have macroed Blood Fury, Demon Soul, and Metamorphosis together into one button. Is this a mistake? I am doing myself a disservice by not using each of them on their own cooldown?

I am peaking at 12k dps and averaging 9-10k dps against bosses. In heroics its usually around 7-8k. There was a hunter in the Baradin Hold group I was in last night that was doing 16k dps. The only time I was able to maintain 11-12k was when I had my cooldowns popped and my Doomguard summoned during that fight (my only raid experience so far in Cataclysm). I wish I had remembered to log the fight so I could see where I was going wrong. =[

My hit is 16.55% which means I need to bump that up a bit more and I could use some more 346 gear to finish out a few rough spots but can anyone give me some advice on managing the rotation and keeping DPS strong during movement phases? Any other abilities I should macro together to reduce hotkey/button clutter?

#29 Demi9OD

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Posted 17 December 2010 - 09:44 PM

I have macroed Blood Fury, Demon Soul, and Metamorphosis together into one button. Is this a mistake? I am doing myself a disservice by not using each of them on their own cooldown?

I am peaking at 12k dps and averaging 9-10k dps against bosses. In heroics its usually around 7-8k. There was a hunter in the Baradin Hold group I was in last night that was doing 16k dps. The only time I was able to maintain 11-12k was when I had my cooldowns popped and my Doomguard summoned during that fight (my only raid experience so far in Cataclysm). I wish I had remembered to log the fight so I could see where I was going wrong. =[

My hit is 16.55% which means I need to bump that up a bit more and I could use some more 346 gear to finish out a few rough spots but can anyone give me some advice on managing the rotation and keeping DPS strong during movement phases? Any other abilities I should macro together to reduce hotkey/button clutter?


Blood Fury and Demon Soul should be macro'd together, since they always line up. I would not recommend adding Meta to that macro. With poor or incredible Impending Doom RNG you're delaying cooldowns multiple times per raid mob. In heroics you might not even get a chance for a second Meta.

Use timer bars with fixed duration support for Demon Soul and Metamorphosis. ButtonTimers is a great cooldown/aura tracking mod with fixed time length support. Set your timers for Meta and DS to a 15 second fixed time. If one of the timers runs out before the other begins moving, blow the cooldown. 15 seconds is an arbitrary setting but you get the idea, set it to the longest time you are willing to delay a cooldown.

Well configured timers can help with your rotation in other ways too. Configure an Improved Soul Fire bar with a -1 second adjustment to account for travel time. Set the bar to warn less than cast time. When the bar turns red, that is the absolute earliest you can begin casting Soul Fire without overlapping the proc. Configure an Immolate bar with a -2 second adjustment (lower this as your haste increases) and warn less than cast time. When the bar turns red that is the earliest you can cast Immolate and only overlap one tick.

The only other macros I use for Demonology are Felstorm/Hellfire and Felstorm/Shadow Flame for AOE situations. There is simply a lot of hotkey/button clutter for Warlocks in cata, hopefully others will have good tips on how they have been able to reduce it.

#30 nehcnhoj

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Posted 17 December 2010 - 10:07 PM

Just out of curiosity, what is the logic behind casting our soulfire such that it refreshes the buff "ideally" 0.1 secs after the buff runs off? Wouldn't starting the soulfire cast a split second before the haste buff runs off be a better rotation? My logic behind this is, soulfire is one of our lowest DPET skills(without decimate), therefore if we cast it more often, (as a result of the 0.1 sec refreshing buff logic) the resulting rotation is a lower dps? Is there any benefit from having a 0.1 gap inbetween buffs as opposed to a 1+ maybe 2 second gap? In both scenarios the cast right after SF would not benefit from the 15% haste (i believe), so I'm not sure what the point is here.

If i'm totally off on something I do apologise.

#31 lhsansshade

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Posted 18 December 2010 - 12:47 AM

I see in your spell priority list that casting a MC Incinerate is listed as a higher priority than a Decimate Soulfire. However in the sim chart Soulfire has 3k higher DPE. Could you explain which spell has priority in the execution phase?

#32 Jmickey

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Posted 18 December 2010 - 07:38 AM

I see in your spell priority list that casting a MC Incinerate is listed as a higher priority than a Decimate Soulfire. However in the sim chart Soulfire has 3k higher DPE. Could you explain which spell has priority in the execution phase?


Soul Fire doesn't proc Impending Doom, so it does not lower the cooldown on Metamorphosis. Also, the DPE on an MC Incinerate and a Decimated Soul Fire aren't as far apart as you think, ignoring Impending Doom procs and the effect they have, casting only Soul Fire while decimate is up and ignoring Incinerate when MC procs results in a 20 dps increase at lower gear levels (iLvl 346) and almost a 100dps loss at higher gear levels (iLvl 372).

#33 Tahapenes

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Posted 18 December 2010 - 04:20 PM

I see in your spell priority list that casting a MC Incinerate is listed as a higher priority than a Decimate Soulfire. However in the sim chart Soulfire has 3k higher DPE. Could you explain which spell has priority in the execution phase?


I had thought as you until I started looking at heroic boss fights.

I don't have WoLs to back this up, however what I have observed from watching individual fights with my present stats (13% base haste + SF buff + DI), MC Incinerate is casting at 1.1 to 1.2 seconds and doing 7.2k non-crit damage and Decimate Soulfire is casting for 1.4 seconds and doing around 7.5k non-crit damage. As such, the MC Incinerates are working out to slightly higher DPS under execute phase.

Also, until Blizzard fixes the meta requirements for Chaotic, I would use Lightning Dream Emeralds (Hit/Haste) in yellow sockets (if below hit cap and not close to haste threshold) to fulfill the meta requirement.

#34 Whitebushido

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Posted 18 December 2010 - 11:48 PM

Anyone else seem to have problems with the Doomguard? I'll summon him and often times he just sits there. Doesn't matter if there's a doom up already or not or even if I reapply it once he comes out, even tried forcing pet attack. Infernal hasn't failed for me yet so I just use it instead.

Am I missing something or is he just poorly coded?
Posted Image

#35 NYsLegend

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 02:49 AM

Here is a Macro I found useful from a friend of mine. This will add Felstorm to your Spells. If this Macro was posted in the old Warlock thread then im sorry.
#showtooltip Shadow Bolt
/script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()
/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/cast Felstorm
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1
/cast Shadow Bolt

#36 VoidStar

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Posted 20 December 2010 - 08:50 AM

Here is a Macro I found useful from a friend of mine. This will add Felstorm to your Spells. If this Macro was posted in the old Warlock thread then im sorry.
#showtooltip Shadow Bolt
/script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear()
/console Sound_EnableSFX 0
/cast Felstorm
/console Sound_EnableSFX 1
/cast Shadow Bolt


This is only a good idea if it's always fine to cast Felstorm when you cast Shadow Bolt, which given today's CC environment is often not the case. If you want to macro Felstorm onto an ability, then I suggest doing it on an ability that you'll only be casting when AoE is "safe". At the moment I've got mine macro'd onto a Shadowflame/Immolation Aura "I'm in melee range and it's fine to AoE" macro and I just manually cast it if I can't be in melee range but it's fine for my Felguard to AoE.

Generally speaking, there's a few other things that could improve your macro, but what you've got will work.

#37 Peste

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Posted 21 December 2010 - 05:42 AM

I was wondering if anyone has done or could do the math regarding whether or not Demo has a soft haste cap which may cause it's weight to drop in regards to haste > crit > mastery.

My experience so far in avg ilvl 343 gear is that with decimate and molten core I am approaching 1 sec cast times. Shadowolt obviously is nt close, but is still at 1.8 sec by keeping up Imp. Soul Fire. This makes me wonder whether the value of haste may diminish as we become well geared and our nukes encroach on the GCD.

Now, I realize that MC, Decimation, and ISF do not increase HASTE, but rather decrease cast time. This means that Immolate and corruption damage is unaffected and raw haste on gear will continue to provide dps increases in this regard. But will those two spells continue to be worth gearing for haste past a theoretical sweet spot? Or will we eventually want to hover at some haste % in the future and otherwise reforge those additional points into crit or mastery?

As an aside, yet slightly related discussion - most of the currently available dps cloth epics have mastery on them, a stat we currently are ignoring. Is there a consensus on how this may affect Demo's viability as raids progress deeper into content as opposed to Afflic or Destruct who value mastery much higher.

I appreciate any intelligent discussion regarding these points or any math that may back up any one point or another. Thanks.

#38 getajob92

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Posted 21 December 2010 - 10:49 AM

Sorry if this should go in the simple questions/answers forum. Thought it would be slightly more appropriate here and I haven't seen any discussion on it. Does HoG's place on the priority list still apply if I've just just refreshed immolate with fel flame (for whatever reason)? Does the nuke itself and the unnecessary re-refreshing of immolate really come before refreshing BoD/Corruption if they, say, drop off?

#39 VoidStar

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Posted 21 December 2010 - 12:35 PM

Sorry if this should go in the simple questions/answers forum. Thought it would be slightly more appropriate here and I haven't seen any discussion on it. Does HoG's place on the priority list still apply if I've just just refreshed immolate with fel flame (for whatever reason)? Does the nuke itself and the unnecessary re-refreshing of immolate really come before refreshing BoD/Corruption if they, say, drop off?


Fel Flame only extends the duration of Immolate a relatively small amount, so the refresh from a Cremation-empowered Hand of Gul'dan is not "unnecessary" as you'd still need to refresh it quite soon anyway.

It's not really possible to determine from the posted simcraft output whether deferring HoGd in the situation you describe is worth while because the situation you describe does not occur in the simulation under test and the DPET of HoGd does not factor in its side effects. If you could construct a scenario where it did occur then you could trial different priority lists to see whether it appeared to be beneficial or not. However, in a different scenario where movement or immunities occur many other things would also need to be re-assessed in the priority list. Otherwise all you can hope for is peoples' gut feelings on the matter.

#40 Rizey

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Posted 21 December 2010 - 01:55 PM

Just a suggestion on the AoE damage:

I find that an immolate per target (if there are too many, than just a few) into HoG (for Felguard crit) -> Meta/Demon Soul -> Demon Leap (crits for roughly 12k per target for me) -> Immo Aura -> Shadowflame -> Hellfire, while at some point using Felstorm. Recommended that after 1-2 ticks of Hellfire, use Soulshatter, and recast Hellfire (assuming you are pulling threat, which you no doubt will). Infernal may also be used here if the targets have a higher-than-normal health pool, and don't mind using your cooldown.

All in all, very great thread. I was a little worried that Demonology would not be viable in Cataclysm with all the re-works, but fortunately I can still play my favorite spec!

EDIT: Just realized the suggestion is strictly for AoE non-boss packs (such as the ones early in Bastion of Twilight) as you'll be using Meta/Demon Soul/Immo Aura for the boss itself, but might get a Demon Leap off if you're lucky on the timing. Also might be worthy to note that Soul Burn is very useful for refreshing Improved Soul Fire, and Drain Soul on adds to refresh shards.




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