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Priest Healing Discussion: Cataclysm


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#41 Sinndir

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 08:47 PM

Quick question, I assume that the Pain Suppression Glyph works during Heroic Halfus 25 man's Furious Roar. Can anyone confirm?


It does, and it works perfectly. That same glyph will also work for Guardian Spirit next patch.

#42 ZODD1

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 05:26 AM

Lately I noticed some strange behavior with Mass Dispel, especially on Cho'gall ( frapsed it here YouTube - Mass Dispel fails ), it seems to ignore some targets and I have to cast it 3-4 times until I get everyone out.
Did anyone noticed something similar, or any ideas what could cause this?

Here are some logs from the first 5 Mass Dispels in the video:

[22:29:59.615] Nanda begins to cast Mass Dispel
[22:30:00.494] Nanda's Mass Dispel dispells Stulle's Psychic Scream
[22:30:00.494] Nanda's Mass Dispel dispells Animositi's Mark of the Wild
[22:30:01.451] Nanda begins to cast Mass Dispel
[22:30:03.444] Nanda begins to cast Mass Dispel
[22:30:03.883] Nanda Mass Dispel Cho'gall Miss
[22:30:04.074] Nanda's Mass Dispel dispells Sme's Psychic Scream
[22:30:05.262] Nanda begins to cast Mass Dispel
[22:30:06.716] Nanda begins to cast Mass Dispel
[22:30:07.209] Nanda Mass Dispel Cho'gall Miss
[22:30:07.661] Nanda's Mass Dispel dispells Shadraz's Psychic Scream



#43 Crow

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 02:01 PM

The video was uploaded yesterday, but when was it recorded? Maybe this has something to do with the trapdoor issue hotfixed recently?

#44 ZODD1

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 03:06 PM

The video was uploaded yesterday, but when was it recorded? Maybe this has something to do with the trapdoor issue hotfixed recently?


It was recorded yesterday.

#45 Sinndir

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 05:44 PM

Mass Dispel has long been wonky in choosing targets that have nothing to dispel on them, while leaving targets in need still inflicted.

This was happening even before the dispel mechanic change (unable to dispel unless there was something you could). It would not surprise me one bit if you were seeing strange targetting issues.

Have you posted that on the bug reports forum?

#46 ZODD1

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 08:53 PM

I can't post it on US forums, and EU forums don't have bug reports.

#47 Barlow

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Posted 16 February 2011 - 12:04 PM

I can't post it on US forums, and EU forums don't have bug reports.


Sure that this is a bug? I'm not aware, if dispel mechanics have been changed since WotLK but unless you have enough hit on your gear a dispel on friendly targets could always miss.

#48 RamonKahn

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Posted 16 February 2011 - 12:50 PM

Even if the dispel misses, it should be written in the combatlog (just like with the dispels that miss Cho'Gall). However, as seen in the video, the Raid stacks up with everyone in Range, but some of the Fears aren't dispelled by first/second dispel.

You could test if it is really an issue because of the trapdoor by positioning the raid somewhere else. If the dispel still does not work correctly, then it probably is a targeting bug.

#49 Carnathagia

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Posted 16 February 2011 - 01:58 PM

It's likely nothing to do with the floor; the same thing happens on Argaloth. It's possible to have both ranged groups and the melee group close enough on his hitbox to be covered by one Mass Dispel, but it's only random chance as to how many of the debuffs it will actually clear. It seems to be a targetting issue with Mass Dispel itself. I suppose this fits with Blizzard's model of allowing dispels to go off on targets that don't need it, but it seems to unfairly penalize Mass Dispel, especially with the very high mana cost involved.
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#50 Guest_Aetherlight_*

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Posted 17 February 2011 - 02:47 AM

Blessed Resilience is currently proc'ing from critical HoT ticks (my own hots and others' HoTs on me as well) I don't think this is as intended because the tooltip says "critically hit by any attack."

#51 Verakith

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Posted 17 February 2011 - 06:32 AM

When they changed dispel mechanics to always cast regardless if a debuff is or is not on the target they also applied it to Mass Dispel. What you're seeing is Mass Dispel using its 10 "charges" on random players and NPC's in the raid.

#52 Darkmother

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 03:51 AM

I have tried to heal as atonement spec on magmaw and came up very short to the point i was politely replaced in the raid. I am currently ilvl 353. I had a pally and druid on heals pushing 12k hps while i was at half that. Either I'm doing something wrong or discipline is just not the right spec for this boss.

My top heals for the fight were Atonement PWS and Renew. This is my armory link Darkmother @ Turalyon - Game - World of Warcraft. I am currently looking for 3 more pieces but have not seen 1 of them drop despite the numerous dungeon runs.

My experience with the fight is that it is not a tank healing fight same goes for the Halfus fight. The entire raid takes unavoidable damage. Spamming bubble is just not the way to go and smiting only helps the classes that r within range and at random. I could use some help healing these encounters.

I love disc healing and it kicks the crap out of any heroic battle but sadly has left me feeling very disappointed as a raid healing spec. Any advice on how to make this work.

#53 napsilan

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 06:24 AM

On heroic magmaw, I was the top healer as disc (World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis). One slight different is that the extra adds on heroic give you something better to smite than the boss, since you'll have more/better atonement targets in range. Prayer of healing was my workhorse (~40% w/ DA), with shield (25%) and a variety of other heals filling out the rest. Archangel was mostly used for lava spew.

#54 Starfire

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 06:36 AM

Get better assignments then. Smite is good on Magmaw, because it smart targets and if it's not healing your melee in need it's healing your tank and putting up a bubble.

More importantly, it allows you to build up Evangelism. Then convert Evangelism for Archangel to handle the Spew which comes out around every 20-25 seconds or so. Spew deals ~100k damage to the raid of so.

You can cheat a little and start casting your Prayer of Healing's a little bit earlier to put up the guaranteed Divine Aegis on the raid, or at least 2-3 parties or so -- this is effectively like "downranking" PW:S spam, but it's sustainable for longer periods.

For me, a single Prayer of Healing on the party should put up around a 4-9k shield or so, depending on crits. It also applies the 20% HoT.

Depending on your mana situation, you can start selectively pre-shielding people as well. Like those pesky mages who always seem to have the lowest health. Shield up 3-4 people in 1-party, Prayer of Healing another 1-2 parties before the Spew. Then of course spam your little heart out with Prayer of Healing during/directly-after the Spew.

In general, you should be worth your raid spot because of the Barrier and because those Divine Aegis extends the effective health of the raid.

Everyone should start from the same place and rise based on their abilities, desires, and schedule. No one plays MMOs to *be* powerful, they play MMOs to *become* powerful. It's the journey, stupid. The rarer loot is, the more cherished it is when you get it, but only so long as there is a reasonable expectation to get it. The rarer loot is, the better it feels when you kill a boss or when $AWESOME_TRINKET drops.


#55 onceler21

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 06:43 AM

Atonement spec doesn't mean you have to, or even should, use atonement for most of your healing. I have atonement in my disc spec (which I use for Magmaw heroic (10man)), but only cast smite during impale phase (or occasionally when everyone is topped off and I have nothing better to do). For the rest of the time, I'm mostly tank healing (with shields/penances/gheal spam), with some PoH and shielding low health raid members during lava spews.

If another healer is covering tank heals, so you are assigned to raid, then I would expect to see PoH as your #1 healing spell, with PW:S and aegis as #2 and #3. That said, you would be better served switching to a holy spec. Disc is only good raid healing when there are opportunities to use PW:B, and on Magmaw, people are typically too spread out for it to be effective.

#56 Crow

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 11:37 AM

I assume Darkmother is talking about non heroic 10 man version and I totally agree with onceler21. Atonement heals are one of your worst HPS spells. Unless fight provides you with some boost to boss damage Atonement heals are roughly equivalent to Heal. Now, no doubt your healing done is half of what other healers do if most of your healing done comes from Heal.

When situation is stable you can use it due to its decent HPM and in order to build Evangelism stacks. But if people are dying you need to throw your stronger heals - pws, penances, gheals on single target or PoH on groups.

Having said that Holy is currently believed to be a better group healing spec, but in 10 mans where there is lesser need for specialization you should be able to do well as disc.

#57 Psilux

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 05:37 PM

In 353 ilevel gear, you can spec out of atonement / archangel and get along fine without it. Atonement heals are terrible for throughput. I place a priority system on my heals as a discipline priest: PW:S > Penance > Gheal.

Now let me explain it more.:

As a discipline priest, your mastery plugs directly into your pw:s. This should hit between 25-29k hp depending on your mastery. It's an instant cast 29k heal. It should be glyphed, so you get a heal after it expends, and you also proc rapture (mana return). Finally, it procs borrowed time, which is a haste increase. Next if penance is not on cooldown, use this. It does not expend your borrowed time buff, which means you can cast ANOTHER SPELL with 14% haste, it procs 3 stacks of grace improving your healing by 24% on that target. Follow this up with a greater heal (still hasted by 14% and improved by 24% healing).

For multiple targets, if you can sustain your PW:S raid spam, it's the highest you can do with the least amount of overhealing. With all the nerfs and changes to disc PW:S, most people cannot sustain this, so consider throwing out 3-5 PW:S and then switching to prayer of healing. For maximum healing per sec (HPS), you can interweave your PW:S and POH so that your POH benefits from the borrowed time buff. That'll make you highly competitive with all the other healers (I was finishing first last night on heroic attempts with PW:S spam).

#58 tedv

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 05:47 PM

The point of Atonement was never smite. It was Archangel. Nearly every hard fight in the game has some phase where you really need to pump out a lot of healing, preceded by some lull in healing. It's well worth 3 talent points to get 15% extra healing on demand. It's just that once you've already invested 3 points in Archangel, you might as well pick up Atonement for 2 more points.

Once you start doing more heroic fights, I think you'll find that Archangel is really important. Especially give the alternatives for those talent points-- there's not much of value available.

#59 Psilux

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 11:13 PM

The point of Atonement was never smite. It was Archangel. Nearly every hard fight in the game has some phase where you really need to pump out a lot of healing, preceded by some lull in healing. It's well worth 3 talent points to get 15% extra healing on demand. It's just that once you've already invested 3 points in Archangel, you might as well pick up Atonement for 2 more points.

Once you start doing more heroic fights, I think you'll find that Archangel is really important. Especially give the alternatives for those talent points-- there's not much of value available.



So you recommend speccing out of attonement then? I don't see the utilitiy in 5 talent points to get a mediocre heal and regen talent, when you can pick up borrowed time. I was putting heavy emphasis on focused will, but after reviewing my combat logs, I don't see it proccing as much as I thought (had hoped). Maybe you're right about attonement and that there is nothing left to pick up.

#60 Judithe

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 12:01 AM

So you recommend speccing out of attonement then? I don't see the utilitiy in 5 talent points to get a mediocre heal and regen talent, when you can pick up borrowed time. I was putting heavy emphasis on focused will, but after reviewing my combat logs, I don't see it proccing as much as I thought (had hoped). Maybe you're right about attonement and that there is nothing left to pick up.


I don't think it's really a choice between Atonement and Borrowed Time. Regardless of whether or not you pick up Atonement you still probably want to include BT in your talent setup. Focused Will is definitely something I would avoid in a PVE spec when the disc tree already has talent bloat.

If you're throwing out smites in situations where there isn't heavy raid damage flying around to keep your evangelism stack active and maxed, you may as well spec into atonement to allow it to do a little bit of healing at the same time.




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