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[Balance] Simple Questions + WoL Feedback


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#21 Wòlfwood

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Posted 28 May 2011 - 10:08 PM

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I am trying to figure out why my dps drops so much on chimaeron my only though is that it is the hit debuff slowing my progression to eclipses. Also any pointers you notice would be appreciated.

#22 Latas

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 02:04 PM

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I am trying to figure out why my dps drops so much on chimaeron my only though is that it is the hit debuff slowing my progression to eclipses. Also any pointers you notice would be appreciated.


A few big things for me were 1. prioritizing dots a bit more as they will keep ticking when you are debuffed. 2. Making sure that you do not under any circumstance use starsurge while debuffed, it was a huge loss of dps for me. and 3. if you have nothing else to do take that time to place 1 or 2 mushrooms or detonate them as the detonation isn't affected by the debuff.

#23 Melador

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 05:03 AM

I'm comparing my Sinestra dps to some ranked-but-not-crazy kills on WoL, and I notice that my dps is considerably lower but most of that is in missing damage to whelps, and most of that appears to be sunfire/insect swarm. Do most people actually dot up whelps during that phase? We've been AoE bursting them down at particular times in p3, which doesn't leave time for much more than a set of mushrooms exploding.

edit: Asking around it sounds like most (all?) of the top moonkin parses are from single-killing whelp strats (with lots of DoTs to get them low).

#24 Guest_Acquiesced_*

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 07:46 PM

I have two questions.

I am a newish Boomkin druid trying to make my way into the entry level raids. Because of this, I am trying to get my gear more in order before I apply to any guilds or take any pug runs and look like an idiot.

My first question is about haste. I have calculated the haste breakpoints for IS/MF to be 67(10th tick), 1422(11th tick) and 2776(12th tick). First of all, are these numbers correct?

Second of all, I am currently sitting on 1763 haste rating (which is 13.77% without Moonkin Aura, and 19.46% with Moonkin Aura). Does this mean that I should reforge the 300ish haste above 1422 (or more, considering moonkin aura isn't applied to the raw number on screen) into something like Mastery? Also, How do I compute something like Nature's Grace when trying to figure out how much haste I can afford to reforge?

I have tried looking at the WrathCalcs listed in the sticky for some help with these matters, but I am running a Mac with Keynote (the iWork Suite) and do not have Excel. In Keynote the boxes and formatting become screwed up and the spreadsheet doesn't work.

Sorry for the noob question.

You can find my gear and more information below
Profiler - Wowhead

Thank you very much for taking the time to read this. :)

#25 Pyrius

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 08:12 PM

Don't worry about haste breakpoints. I encourage you to reread the Balance forum thread first post. Hamlet quite clearly states that haste beats mastery point for point. There is no qualification about that point. Gearing really is as simple as stated in that post:
"The stat priority can be briefly summarized as:
Int >> haste = hit/Spirit > mastery > crit"

#26 Hamlet

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Posted 20 June 2011 - 09:25 PM

Hmm, although I should really update that to:
Int >> Haste > hit/Spirit = mastery > crit.

Hit is most frequently traded for mastery in the reforging process; in my experience you rarely have to resort to sacrificing haste to meet the hit cap. In practice you reforge Spirit <-> mastery as necessary to meet cap, and that makes Spirit basically equivalent to mastery when selecting gear.

#27 benscott

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Posted 29 June 2011 - 10:53 PM

Hey, Ive been doing some raids today and I want you guys to take a look at the logs and maybe you can make sense of which is better.

These are my logs from tonights Shannox boss
Log 1.
I simply roll dots on all of the dogs and the boss its self, my spec has LS and i didnt move alot in the fight
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis


Log 2. This is our ranged officer who is a boomkin who has favored no LS spec and to spam Sunfire while Rolling IS on all 3 targets.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

He heavily out gears me and i beat him on overall damage on the kill (World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis)
Altho most of the fights to follow and the wipes before hand he wants topping the meters by using his "spam Sunfire" rotation.

This has got to me because i know my rotation is more complex and should therfore (when done correctly) be alot more powerful but that doesnt seem to be the case.
I thought with the changes to LS it would stop his but just unspecing the talent seems to have negated the changes.

Ideas/comments please!

#28 qae

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Posted 03 July 2011 - 03:58 AM

I'm having some troubles figuring if swapping 359 T11 shoulder and head for 372 non-set (thus losing 4T11) would be worth it. I'm not sure how many stats we are willing to sacrifice for the new 4T11. It obviously still have some value, and I am well aware that the issue will be moot as soon as I can get my hands on 2T12, but in the mean time since I do have the 372 non-set pieces (Hide of Chromaggus and Helm of the Blind Seer) I'm just toying with the idea.

My eclipse rotation time seems to be around 50sec, in which I have 16sec maximum of Astral Alignment. If I can consider Astral alignment as a 16sec +10% crit chance (it's late so that might be terrible wrong of an assumption), the 4pT11 would average a 10*(16/50)=3.2% crit chance.
Of course there is the fact that I will probably use +15% crit chance eclipsed SS or SF at the beginning of eclipse, which will complicate the issue, but I think the consensus for max dps is to currently ignore the 4T11 bonus, so it might also be a Moonfire that get the crit.

So is that accurate? Can we even remotely consider the 4T11 as a flat 3% crit chance give or take? That would help.

If my drowsy napkin math is utterly nonsense please feel free to correct me. You can mock me too, that's ok.

#29 Erdluf

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Posted 03 July 2011 - 04:18 AM

Wrong thread. deleted.

#30 Gitaxias

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Posted 10 July 2011 - 11:52 AM

Hi, fellow boomkin here, got a couple of questions, most of them are related to burst dps.

First off, the trinket , I'm assuming the answer is yes as it is still in the updated Balance thread, but is this still worth using as of 4.2?

Secondly, what about activated trinkets? Both the Balance thread here and Mr Robot (which I admittedly don't really trust when it comes to trinkets, says some wacky stuff sometimes) say that and are the best-in-slot trinkets, but I (and I have by no means done the math, just shallow logic on my part) feel inclined to think that a use-effect trinket would be pretty great in any fight where you need burst during a specific burn phase.

My third and last question is related to the profession perks. As pretty much everyone seems to agree about, Tailoring is a great profession as it provides more intellect than others at this point. The Balance thread used to say that it provided 120 intellect but now only says 90 intellect despite there being no changes to the embroidery (not that I haven't missed, anyway). What's up with that? Would love to know the reasoning behind it, don't sweat it though, that's not my main concern. In the second profession slot it doesn't really seem to be that important to have a specific profession as long as you have one of the "hi, I provide 80 intellect" ones, which there are a lot of. I personally have opted to use blacksmithing as it has the two benefits of being able to provide more than just intellect (largely irrelevant, I know, but still something) and the fact that it is pretty much guaranteed to provide 100 intellect in the future since stormjewels have been datamined and provide 50 in a stat. Jewelcrafting provides 1 more intellect than the other professions and the only real reason I don't use that before blacksmithing is that I didn't pick it up to begin with, it is undeniably stronger right now but it feels like it is not as much of a safe card as blacksmithing is when it comes to a future epic gem patch (getting 51 intellect rather than 81 would be disappointing, in case they leave the jc gems unchanged). Up until recently I have considered Tailoring + Jewelcrafting to be the optimal profession choices, but it recently hit me that the 80 intellect that engineering gets is actually a use-effect. Again, I'm far from experienced when it comes to complicated math so I haven't crunched any numbers but wouldn't engineering provide much stronger benefits than the other professions, considering that you can pop it during Bloodlust, during Berserking (troll racial) etc.? I also believe it synergizes well with our DoTs since they read your spell power when they are applied, correct me if I'm wrong but I'd think that gives you quite a bit of additional damage even if it's not in an ideal DoT situation (Solar Eclipse + DoTing up Beth'tilac spiderlings or something similar), right? Lastly, I'm aware that the engineering use-effect has a 20 sec shared cooldown with use trinkets. If you do choose to pick up engineering, would this affect your trinket choices for just a normal fight, and/or for the kind of fight where you would use Sorrowsong (and assuming I'm onto something in question 2, a use-effect trinket) like Beth'tilac or Ascendant Council?

Thanks a bunch in advance and terribly sorry about the wall of text, I've got a nasty habit of using unecessarily many words to say something that I could've conveyed in half the amount of text. :c

#31 Smartiepants

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Posted 13 July 2011 - 07:01 PM

For professions they generally update all others to provide the same benefit when epic gems are released. Tailoring I believe was hotfixed to be generally equal. On use do have their advantages and generally can be considered stronger however may not align well with mechanics. Would be tough to model.

#32 rundxdi

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 07:23 PM

I feel like I must be doing something wrong with my single target rotation.

Here's a log from our last kill of normal baleroc:
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I know my spec is still a little heavy on utility talents, (most notably dreamstate which I still have because last week I needed it for beth) and except for one point where I had to move more than expected on baleroc I felt like I was doing my rotation properly. I have focus magic but I'm just wondering if my dps feels low on the fight because of not complete raid buffs or if there's something that shows up wrong with my rotation. Any help is appreciated.

e: armory is up to date although at the time I had the 372 t11 chest and regular theralion's instead of the necromantic focus.

#33 Balbus

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 12:15 AM

I am very lucky to pic up the T12 2pc today. Am I right that the summoned fire treants do no kind of damage? First I checked "recount". But this was to vague for stating this right. So here is a short non representative log file of nearly 5 mins simply castng wrath and starfire from elcpise to eclipse.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I noticed 5 summons of the firetreant (seems to have a normal icd so far) but I can not see any output made. Am I right? Is Blizz kidding us? Forgiveme if I am just not capable to see every nesseesary aspect.

(Sry if you find it irritating that I post here as a shaman. This regards my moonkin alt.)

#34 Latas

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 01:14 AM

I am very lucky to pic up the T12 2pc today. Am I right that the summoned fire treants do no kind of damage? First I checked "recount". But this was to vague for stating this right. So here is a short non representative log file of nearly 5 mins simply castng wrath and starfire from elcpise to eclipse.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I noticed 5 summons of the firetreant (seems to have a normal icd so far) but I can not see any output made. Am I right? Is Blizz kidding us? Forgiveme if I am just not capable to see every nesseesary aspect.

(Sry if you find it irritating that I post here as a shaman. This regards my moonkin alt.)


World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Its a pet for you so you have to expand your damage listing on the damage done section and select the burning treant.

#35 bickel

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Posted 20 July 2011 - 09:28 AM

Hello. My mainspec is Resto, but occasionally I raid as Moonkin, and my DPS feels lower than it should be. Much of my gear is shared between the two specs; the main differences are:
Head - Got a 353 head with a burning shadowspirit in it.
Trinkets - Bell of Enraging Resonance & Witching Hourglass
Gloves & Legs - Hydrolance gloves & Leggings of consuming flame replacing Resto T11.

Here's a WoL report for Baleroc:
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Question is, which single action would show the best increase in DPS:

Get more dedicated moonkin gear, and reforge spirit away until I'm not wasting stats being past the hitcap.
Get justice points and buy T11 moonkin set pieces
Get better trinkets
Respec
Improve my rotation, improve dot uptime, stop clipping dots, react faster to starsurge procs
Improve my AoE damage - I find mushrooms fiddly to use, and when multidotting I sometimes tab back onto a target I've already dotted.

#36 Indelible Force

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Posted 01 August 2011 - 10:17 PM

Hi all.

I just started raiding this tier, and I think my dps is a mite bit low. Could you help me out?
Here are the parses:
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

specifically: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis


The first night was all but our kills on fandral and the last night was fandral kill and ragnaros attempts. I am consistently in the bottom half of the dps. Although last tier I was used to being in the top 5 dps.

Is it just my gear that has fallen behind? I am using RAWR for calculations and I am low on almost every fight. RAWR has me doing 19.6k (18.5 w/o elemental oath, which we don't have) dps but I usually am lower than that by a considerable bit on Beth'tilac, Rhyolith, Baleroc, Fandral, and Ragnaros. I seem to be doing well at Shannox, but that is just because I dot everything and dps Shannox with my many starsurge procs.

Also, any advice on Alysrazor would be nice. I am one of the fliers. What should I be spamming in the air as I am following her? Just follow the rotation?


I guess it would help me to have a general strategy for all the HMs in tier 12. Granted, I had a lot of practice in t11 so I may warm up to my dps after raiding for more than one week, but I didn't see too many ways to improve my dps that seemed very straight forward.

Here is my armory profile: Erygwn @ Eonar - Game - World of Warcraft

#37 li0nhar79

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 10:10 AM

I have browsed though the balance threads and have not found an answer I was hoping for. Sorry if it has been answered before but I am curious how out mastery works. I know it beefs up our eclipses but does the increase in damage occur only at the eclipse or can the damage increase also occur with a mastery proc once eclipse is already on. I have an on use mastery trinket I am just wondering if I should use just before eclipse or just use even during an eclipse. Thanks =)

#38 Latas

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 12:18 PM

I have browsed though the balance threads and have not found an answer I was hoping for. Sorry if it has been answered before but I am curious how out mastery works. I know it beefs up our eclipses but does the increase in damage occur only at the eclipse or can the damage increase also occur with a mastery proc once eclipse is already on. I have an on use mastery trinket I am just wondering if I should use just before eclipse or just use even during an eclipse. Thanks =)


Eclipse itself updates dynamically, the tooltip on the buff however does not, but you are getting the benefit of the mastery proc even if it is used after you are already in eclipse.

#39 MoonslayerLB

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 07:52 PM

edit: question removed, apparently i forgot to do some more checks, and found the answer

#40 Nivv

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Posted 18 August 2011 - 06:11 PM

Recently my guild has been having issues with boomkins not taking a mass res, and running back in order to kill critters on the way, to move their eclipse bars into a full eclipse prior to pulling. We are having issues with this with regards to them pulling mobs and dying while doing this, or even just waiting longer for them to get back, and then having to wait for them to eat/get buffs. I am curious if in other guilds, the boomkins do this as well, and what kind of DPS gain would they lose out on if they were to start the pull at a 0 eclipse bar compared to if they were to start at a full one.




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