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[Feral] Simple Questions + WoL Feedback


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#41 Finwe_Bear

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Posted 11 July 2011 - 03:22 PM

Kalja, in most cases, a bear will find the 371 pvp items to be a small upgrade over the 359 pve pieces. The difference is very small, and you probably shouldn't go out looking for the pvp upgrades unless you have a lower ilvl piece in your set (346 or 353 items). The only exceptions would be breaking a set bonus or switching to a pvp item with a poor secondary stat (like haste). The benefit is slightly higher for armor pieces vs jewelry pieces, since the higher ilvl also affects the amount of armor on an item.

#42 kalbear

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Posted 12 July 2011 - 04:32 AM

Kalja, in most cases, a bear will find the 371 pvp items to be a small upgrade over the 359 pve pieces. The difference is very small, and you probably shouldn't go out looking for the pvp upgrades unless you have a lower ilvl piece in your set (346 or 353 items).

This is actually pretty incorrect. By most gauges a 371 will be a good upgrade over a 359, and a huge upgrade over a 346. The main reason is not only the large difference in agility and stamina (41/61 agi/stam for an upgrade for a head/chest/legs spot, 33/45 for a glove/shoulder) but the difference in armor. Armor is one of the biggest wins for a bear in general, and an upgrade of 12 ilvls is a huge boost. 94 armor in this case. That doesn't sound like much, but with the bear multiplier that's a very large upgrade. The loss of secondary stats is minor and with reforging you actually get more avoidance over the other piece. What you lose is (at best) some mastery and SD and possibly a bit of threat.

In virtually every case for a bear the 371 pvp gear is more than a small upgrade over the 359 available gear. The only time this isn't as true is when the pve piece has mastery on it natively - and in that case keep in mind that dodge is 3-4 times more valuable than mastery, and agility is 4-5 times more valuable. Which means that in order for that pvp piece to be comparable you need to have (in the above example) 164 mastery on the piece - and that doesn't include the bonus stamina or armor.

Note that the above isn't true for any non-armor pieces. jewelry is not as big an upgrade compared to armor pieces, but depending on the piece can still be a win.

#43 TÃ dus

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Posted 12 July 2011 - 01:33 PM

Hey there, posting from my phone so I appologize for any spelling mistakes; just curious on applying Savage Roar into the rotation, where does it come in? and have done so a few tines with a 5 cp savage roar but lots my 5 point rip to it? what's the solution for 100% uptime?

#44 Guest_Akutsito_*

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 02:11 PM

I remember reading back in WoTLK that opening with SR (1pt) was an increase of dps, is this still the case? (so, Charge, Ravage, SR and start the rotation), or should i go for Rip (5pt) asap?.

#45 Melthu

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 03:03 PM

In WotLK Savage Roar increased all damage, so it only made sense to get it up as quickly as possible. Now that it only buffs auto-attacks you're better off going straight for a 5CP Rip.

#46 Cowmon

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 10:13 PM

Hello, I'm wondering if Ferocious Bite is worth using under Berserk above 25% while keeping in mind rip and sr>fb of course.

I apologize if this is the wrong thread to ask this.

#47 Ilmatar

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Posted 14 July 2011 - 10:33 PM

Mew testing seems to indicate that it is, but only if you have time to build up the CP before you need to refresh Rip or Savage Roar. See the boards over at The Fluid Druid for more info.

#48 shroomz

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 03:30 AM

Simple question: Is the bonus damage from overall damage or, just additional autoattack damage?

I find this to be slightly confusing since the wording on Savage Roar itself is "autoattack damage" and on the glyph"additonal damage", one would expect "additional autoattack damage" if it were just that...

I assume it is just 5% additional autoattack damamge, but if it is 5% allround damage isn't that a must-have glyph?

#49 kalbear

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Posted 15 July 2011 - 06:05 PM

Glyph of Savage Roar only boosts autoattack damage. It is unchanged in value from 4.1 to 4.2 and is the 5th best glyph for DPS.

#50 katala

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 08:36 AM

I have been experiencing a DPS loss since reset this week, have switched UW for a firelands trinket and DPS has improved but nt to where it was :(
Was easily doing 16K on moving fights single target now down to about 14k.
Anybody have any ideas?

#51 Dragilion

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 11:08 AM

I have been experiencing a DPS loss since reset this week, have switched UW for a firelands trinket and DPS has improved but nt to where it was :(
Was easily doing 16K on moving fights single target now down to about 14k.
Anybody have any ideas?


I still play with UW and i managed to put out 32k dps on shannox 25 heroic this wednesday. Im not sure if it was updated by then but i think my dps is still in par with what i used to make not much of a change atleast. You might have just got unlucky with some things and lost a rotation here and there. Just keep working and im sure you will get where you were before.

#52 Odas

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 07:51 PM

There was a bug with rake that was fixed around the same time as the unheeded warning change. Rake was, in addition to the initial application, ticking immediately. This means that instead of having the initial hit and 5 ticks, it had 6 ticks. This is no longer the case.

#53 Panthros

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 12:08 AM

With the recent change of UW, is it now more viable to use it as a bear trinket?

#54 Cluey

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 07:00 PM

I have been experiencing a DPS loss since reset this week, have switched UW for a firelands trinket and DPS has improved but nt to where it was :(
Was easily doing 16K on moving fights single target now down to about 14k.
Anybody have any ideas?

Mew shows your self buffed dps at around those figures, with raid buffs it should be around 21k so I'd say you are doing something wrong. As the warning message from Melthu said, without logs we can't help you much. About all we can do is look at your armory and wonder why you insist on matching socket bonuses instead of putting straight agility gems in.

When I looked before it is showing you as having 47 hit rating too much and you have six socketed. So just changing two of them for straight agility gems gets you 40 more agility for no stat cost as the hit is already doing nothing. Of the items you have put purple gems in only one of them has a socket bonus worth getting, the hat. All of the other ten agility socket bonuses are not worth getting, that includes the legs as it is two non-red sockets for 20 agility.

#55 kalbear

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Posted 08 August 2011 - 03:45 PM

With the recent change of UW, is it now more viable to use it as a bear trinket?

It's more viable but still not nearly as good as , especially when reforged to dodge.

#56 SlackerRat

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 10:11 AM

I just made a try on Target dummy with reforge on crit i had 19k dps over 4 min

Then i reforged to Haste and went to the same dummy.. made same rotation and had a dps on 17k over 4 min

Am i doing something wrong ? or isnt haste better than crit ?

#57 Melthu

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Posted 11 August 2011 - 10:23 AM

Very simply, 2 test runs that lasted 4 minutes each on target dummies with no raid buffs or debuffs will not give you an accurate picture of the difference between reforging for haste or crit. It takes tens or hundreds of thousands of runs to detect differences that small, which is why we have simulators to figure this stuff out.

#58 Guest_aladassa_*

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 07:32 AM

I've recently began bear tanking in a 10 man FL team. I cannot for the life of me get my dodge much past 36%. I've looked around to try to find dodge/dodge rating cap but can't locat anything. I'd apreciate any assistance anyone has. Thank you.

#59 Duilliath

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 09:01 AM

You're a bit high on stamina (pure stamina gem, shifting in a red socket and two pure stamina trinkets), but other than that it's about where you should be at. Just one thing, you might want to consider filling out Perseverance.

Changing one of the trinkets will likely have the biggest impact.

//edit: Additionally, there is no such thing as a Dodge cap. Well, not one that is in any form attainable in the current game.
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#60 Guest_aladassa_*

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Posted 12 August 2011 - 03:59 PM

You're a bit high on stamina (pure stamina gem, shifting in a red socket and two pure stamina trinkets), but other than that it's about where you should be at. Just one thing, you might want to consider filling out Perseverance.

Changing one of the trinkets will likely have the biggest impact.

//edit: Additionally, there is no such thing as a Dodge cap. Well, not one that is in any form attainable in the current game.



so dodge/dodge rating is not effected by diminishing returns or anythning like that?

thanks again.




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