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Mists mechanics testing


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#41 Pathal

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 06:07 AM

Beta Class Balance Analysis Pt. II - Forums - World of Warcraft

Secondly, we posted details on several weapon enchant procs previously, which seemed particularly useful. With that in mind, here are some more:

-- Lord Blastington’s Scope of Doom – 1 PPM, no ICD.
-- Vision of the Predator – 15% chance on direct/periodic spell damage dealt, 105 sec ICD.
-- Carbonic Carbuncle – 15% chance on direct white/melee/ranged/harmful-spell landing, 105 sec ICD.
-- Windswept Pages – 15% chance on direct white/melee/ranged/harmful-spell landing, 65 sec ICD.
-- Searing Words – 45% chance on direct white/melee/ranged/harmful-spell crit, 85 sec ICD.
-- Light of the Cosmos – 15% chance on periodic damage, 45 sec ICD.
-- Essence of Terror – 15% chance on harmful spell landing, 105 sec ICD.
-- Terror in the Mists – 15% chance on direct white/melee/ranged/harmful-spell landing, 105 sec ICD.
-- Darkmist Vortex – 15% chance on direct white/melee/harmful-spell landing, 105 sec ICD.
-- Relic of Yulon – 20% chance on direct/periodic spell damage, 50 sec ICD.
-- Relic of Xuen (STR) – 20% chance on white/yellow melee landing, 45 sec ICD.
-- Relic of Xuen (AGI) – 20% chance on white/yellow/ranged crit, 55 sec ICD.
-- Killing Machine – 6 PPM on white melee landing, no ICD.
-- Sudden Doom – 3 PPM on white melee landing, no ICD.
-- Fangs of the Father
---- Assassination: 23.139% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
---- Combat: 9.438% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
---- Subtlety: 28.223% chance on white/yellow melee landing, no ICD.
---- These chances are multiplied by 0.9 for lvl 89 targets, 0.8 for lvl 90 targets, 0.7 for lvl 91 targets, 0.6 for lvl 92 targets, and 0.5 for lvl 93+ targets.
---- After adding a stack, if you have >30 stacks, you have a [1/(51-stacks)] chance to proc the Fury buff.



#42 Pathal

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 07:42 AM

Hopefully I'll be excused for this one, but I think it warrants the attention of from consecutive posts and not an edit.

I've seen a lot of rumors regarding the direct damage of the new deadly poison acting like a melee swing, but no one testing it. So I did it. I ended up coming across two things. The first is that WoU will not trigger from Mutilate or poisons, but it is working for the rest of the special attacks, including the initial application of Rupture. So I resorted to Shadows of the Destroyer.

Posted Image

You're going to have to trust me on this, but I turned 90 degrees and hit Mutilate once every several seconds (not that energy really allowed me to hit Mutilate on GCD). So, we have two Mutilate hits, and two poison refreshes (and a poison dot tick, but that should be irrelevant), but we gain 3 stacks of Shadows. So in order for us to have 3 stacks of Shadows, at least one of those should be from the poison. I was at the dummies for about an hour after I got that, and was unable to score 3 stacks of Shadows without a poison, so it's probably not a scenario where Mutilate counts as 3 melee attacks.

It might be worth seeing if this applies to other procs in the game. Maybe Shadows of the Destroyer just operates on it's own list of spells, maybe IP 2.0 is now a melee swing under some set definitions of a melee swing, or maybe the devs have created subtle subsets and/or unions of these traditional sets of proc sources, or maybe it's just some really obscure bug.

#43 shadowboy813

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 01:43 AM

I decided to look into how blade flurry interacts with the new AoE rotation.

What I've found is that Fan of Knives is not cleaved by blade flurry at all, but Crimson Tempest is. Also every strike of crimson tempest is cleaved onto a secondary target.

I did this by positioning myself in the middle of the 4 level 85 dummies on the wall in orgrimmar and turned my back to them, using FoK to build combo points. Then after a few seconds pause, I hit crimson tempest to note the blade flurry pattern.

Image link (largish): http://i225.photobuc...oy813/CT_BF.jpg

The left and right dummies cleaved onto the middle right one and the middle right one cleaved onto the left, so the number of blade flurry hits should match crimson tempest hits (unless there is only 1 target in melee/cleavable range, in which case it will be n-1 blade flurry hits--that one target can't cleave onto itself).

There was a random frost dk hitting the dummies and it did supply some interesting information. If you see the blade flurry hit of 4100 it was next to the dummy on the far right which was hit by CT for 3942. 3942*1.04 = 4099.68, which rounds up to 4100. That far right target was out of howling blast range so it did not have the brittle bones debuff. It appears as though blade flurry is affected by the 4% physical vulnerability debuff but does not double-dip from it (as the other 3 crimson tempest hits were on targets with the physical vulnerability debuff and the damage of the cleave was the same). It may be worth testing to see if you hit a target with the 4% physical damage debuff and see if a cleaved target without the debuff has the extra 4% damage copied.


Edit: Disregard the contents of this post. While the information above was correct when I posted it, Crimson Tempest is now no longer cleaved by blade flurry.

#44 Calchexas

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 01:03 PM

It might be worth seeing if this applies to other procs in the game. Maybe Shadows of the Destroyer just operates on it's own list of spells, maybe IP 2.0 is now a melee swing under some set definitions of a melee swing, or maybe the devs have created subtle subsets and/or unions of these traditional sets of proc sources, or maybe it's just some really obscure bug.


I was doing a small amount of testing to see what FoK procs (weapon enchants, trinkets, etc) and thought I was seeing more procs of Shadows of the Destroyer than I expected. I did two short (3 sets of 10 FoK each, hitting 3 Training Dummies and a Raider's Training Dummy, 4 targets total, canceling SoD buff for each set of 10) samples: one with no poisons, one with just Deadly Poison on. I know it's a small sample size, but the results seemed out of the realm of just RNG.

No Poisons: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
Deadly Poison: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

The results were: No poisons - 9 procs, 8 procs, 7 procs
Deadly Poison - 17 procs, 11 procs, 22 procs

I don't recall (someone better with analyzing logs than I can verify) that any SoD procs occurred when the DoT portion of Deadly Poison was applied, but this leads me to believe that the baked in Instant Poison portion of DP will proc things.

If there's any specific testing that I could continue to do to verify this behavior, don't hesitate to let me know

#45 Pathal

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 03:59 AM

Need to add another question.

We need to know how Shadowmeld works with the three t1 talents, if we can still cast stealth abilities from it.

#46 Haileaus

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 04:41 AM

From a really annoying post on the official forums that I won't do you all the disservice of linking, it appears that when Shadowmeld is canceled Subterfuge procs. (this currently means if you use stealth from ShM subterfuge will activate and later break stealth, which was what the poster was complaining about) Anyway with that info it seems likely that we can use openers from ShM, or at the very least after it is canceled if we have Subterfuge.

Note that I have not tested this myself.

#47 Verelyse

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 06:24 PM

From a really annoying post on the official forums that I won't do you all the disservice of linking, it appears that when Shadowmeld is canceled Subterfuge procs. (this currently means if you use stealth from ShM subterfuge will activate and later break stealth, which was what the poster was complaining about) Anyway with that info it seems likely that we can use openers from ShM, or at the very least after it is canceled if we have Subterfuge.

Note that I have not tested this myself.


You are able to use openers out of shadowmeld at 85 without subterfuge as well.

Just tested to make sure it was still true post-5.0.

#48 Pathal

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Posted 12 September 2012 - 08:59 PM

Which brings up another thought. Does Subterfuge trigger MoS if it's activated off of Shadowmeld? What about non-Subterfuge 'melds?

Need to run the full gamut with this ability again.

#49 cerin616

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Posted 07 October 2012 - 09:07 PM

46.

Took off all gear other than legendary daggers. with 1.7% expertise, and 1.44% hit

fighting the raid training dummy (lvel skull, so assumed 3 levels higher than self. On the first killing spree, 1 of the offhand attacks missed.

View image: Wo WScrn Shot 100712 170125

will continue testing for further results.

EDIT: After some more Killing sprees (17 in total) I came up with some interesting data.

I have a total of 119 killing spree hits and 99 killing spree off-hand hits, this is not the 7, 7 I expected. When i first saw discrepancy in the number of hits, I started watching the combat log and counting hits. It looks like the number off attacks can clip from the offhand as well as the main hand. I had one killing spree hit 8 times with mainhand and 6 with offhand and other times have it hit 7 main hand and 5 offhand. It appears that some offhand attacks may be lost for some reason.

To conclude the answer to 46, after 200 total killing spree hits with 1.7% expertise, there were 0 dodges or parries, but there were several misses (20 main hand or 16%, and 12 offhand or 12.1%)

View image: Wo WScrn Shot 100712 170125

View image: Wo WScrn Shot 100712 170125




23.

Thus far it looks like it can be applied by white attacks and can proc the heal off white attacks and main gauche.
After subtracting misses, the number of melee attacks and main gauche is equal to the number of heals i "casted"

View image: Wo WScrn Shot 100712 182757

This was after a data reset once the poison was applied.

With that in mind ill do some testing on other abilities.

EDIT: after 100 sinister strike, 402 melee (59 miss) and 91 main gauche there (534 total hits) were 533 heals from leeching poison. one attack to apply the poison, 100% chance of a heal after that.

EDIT2: 100 Revealing Strike, 326 melee (-47) and 83 main gauche (462 total hits), 459 heals occurred which i think is safe to assume revealing is also 100% chance to proc a heal

Edit3: 80 shivs, 1236 melees (-166) 174 main gauche, 1324 total hits 1324 heals occurred. accidental reset all data in the middle of the test, so i lost the opening hits that apply the poison.
Shiv not only heals 5% of your health, but also procs the 10% of the damage heal

#50 Rfeann

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Posted 18 October 2012 - 07:01 AM

[Post content edited out due to inaccuracy and irrelevance. Two very unfortunate I's.]

#51 Pathal

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Posted 18 October 2012 - 07:06 AM

Deleted. No longer relevant.

#52 Savais

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 09:07 PM

I was reading through the partially answered questions and one struck me with an AH HAH!

"Windsong is a 3ppm1ppm proc with 1''icd that randomly chooses a stat. Different stats don't overwirte themselves; however, same stats do overwrite themselves (even if procced from different weapons); this means: you can have up to 3 different buffs at a time. Known triggers: melee swings and strikes."

I have come to find out that my recouperate tics will proc windsong. Wether this is intended or not and wether it effects it's theory crafting, I know not but I figured that it was usefull to know.

Also, on some rare occasions I have noticed up to 4 buffs of Windsong on myself at a given time. Sadly, this double proc happens in close proximity of one dropping and I haven't been able to catch what is being doubled up and then seeing if it actually is a legit stat bonus or a bug.

#53 Rfeann

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Posted 24 October 2012 - 10:42 PM

Recup triggering the proc is intended, as explained here.

#54 Kneebiter

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 12:52 PM

Would there be any benefit to keep recuperate up in order to gain more procs, or is it just wasted energy? My math skills aren't on par for that task, and I'm not quite sure if it can be simmed correctly or not.

This might be a moot point though, since we will be using Dancing Steel whenever we have the gold for it - and that doesn't proc from recuperate, as far as I know.

#55 Rfeann

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 01:25 PM

If it's working as it was designed to work, then it can potentially proc off of just about anything we do, including special attacks, autoattacks, Rupture ticks and Deadly Poison ticks. There'd be virtually no noticeable benefit to proc rate from mixing Recuperate ticks into that boiling cauldron of proc chances.

Regardless, as noted in the blue post linked just above, the entire point of the new proc mechanic they're testing out here is to more effectively normalize proc chances across specs, classes and playstyles, so there'd never need to be any consideration of altering a rotation to increase proc chance. In theory.

#56 Simply

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 03:22 PM

26. What is the damage range and the swing timer of Ghost Iron Dragonling? does it inherit any of the master's stats?


I did a little testing on the Trinket today and this is what I came up with:

!ASSUMED! 40 Seconds ICD

I could not see any procc behaviour, sometimes he'd procc after 1 second, sometimes after 10.
I had multiple instances where he procced EXACTLY after 40 seconds, thats why I'm assuming a 40 sec. ICD.

The damage range from his auto attacks is 900 ~ 1100

When he spawns he is idling for 3 seconds before he starts to attack the target, which means effectively he only has a 17 second uptime.

He at least breaths 2 times, breath has a 1.7 seconds cast duration.

His swing timer is approx. 1.9 - he does 7 auto attacks during the time he is active.

The Dragonling has no visible pattern in his attacks, sometimes he attacks 1-2 times and breaths, sometimes 3 but he always breaths two times.

Breath has a damage range from 4k - 6k

He does not benefit from the masters stats in any way (same damage when naked, even when you're spell hitcapped his breath CAN miss, so do his melee attacks) and his damage does also not get amplified by Debuffs such as 5% more spelldamage, 12% less armor or even Vendetta.

#57 Aldriana

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Posted 26 October 2012 - 05:27 PM

If it's working as it was designed to work, then it can potentially proc off of just about anything we do, including special attacks, autoattacks, Rupture ticks and Deadly Poison ticks. There'd be virtually no noticeable benefit to proc rate from mixing Recuperate ticks into that boiling cauldron of proc chances.

Regardless, as noted in the blue post linked just above, the entire point of the new proc mechanic they're testing out here is to more effectively normalize proc chances across specs, classes and playstyles, so there'd never need to be any consideration of altering a rotation to increase proc chance. In theory.


In point of fact, if the new proc mechanics are working the way they said they are, there is *no* advantage to performing more triggering attacks. The expected value on number of procs is independent of the number of triggering attacks you perform, provided you're performing a triggering move at least once every 10 seconds.

#58 Zujamar

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 09:41 PM

Not necessarily vital for modeling, but Anticipation has some weird behavior one might run into:
- Recuperate and Slice and Dice do not consume the charges, everything continues as if you did not cast a finisher at all
- Crimson Tempest awards (not one, but) two combo points per Anticipation charge, up to five

I tested this as assassination both against raid mobs and target dummies (and reported as a bug, obviously), and had a friendly rogue replicate the results as combat.

#59 Xaoc

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Posted 30 October 2012 - 10:54 PM

Anticipation requires you to use an offensive finisher; neither Recoup or SnD are offensive.

When you perform an offensive finishing move on an enemy, any Anticipation charges are consumed to grant you an equal number of combo points on that target.



#60 Grimwolf

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Posted 31 October 2012 - 02:47 AM

Not necessarily vital for modeling, but Anticipation has some weird behavior one might run into:
- Recuperate and Slice and Dice do not consume the charges, everything continues as if you did not cast a finisher at all
- Crimson Tempest awards (not one, but) two combo points per Anticipation charge, up to five

I tested this as assassination both against raid mobs and target dummies (and reported as a bug, obviously), and had a friendly rogue replicate the results as combat.


As Xoac said, your first point about Recuperate and Slice and Dice is working as intended. I just tested your second point and can confirm that when I used Crimson Tempest with 1 Anticipation charge, I recieved 2 cps. And when I had 2 charges, I recieved 4 cps. Does anyone know if this is intended or a bug?




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