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Rogue Simple Questions: Mists Edition


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#301 dommy

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Posted 17 September 2013 - 04:09 AM

RPPM still scales with haste, it's only double dip mechanics which got changed. The likes of your legendary meta and cloak are based around haste scaling.


I've always been a little hesitant to blindly go with Shadowcraft's ep values as haste seemed inflated. Even with last patch's RPPM mechanics, I always felt that in a live-raid scenario, realistic mastery was still outperforming realistic haste. Also, if anyone follows the world-class rogues from the various top guilds, there's actually a really decent mixture of those stacking haste and those still stacking pure mastery. If those guys aren't purely going one way or the other, that leaves me more inclined to think that it's a personal, play-style decision and not an absolute necessity.

#302 Norgaard

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Posted 18 September 2013 - 04:37 PM

I've always been a little hesitant to blindly go with Shadowcraft's ep values as haste seemed inflated. Even with last patch's RPPM mechanics, I always felt that in a live-raid scenario, realistic mastery was still outperforming realistic haste. Also, if anyone follows the world-class rogues from the various top guilds, there's actually a really decent mixture of those stacking haste and those still stacking pure mastery. If those guys aren't purely going one way or the other, that leaves me more inclined to think that it's a personal, play-style decision and not an absolute necessity.


Absolutely, I wasn't trying to say that going Haste > Mastery is superior to Mastery > Haste. The difference is negligible, however from my own personal testing since the dispatch buff I have found the Haste build to be a bit more comfortable for me due to easier dispatch spam, it no longer feels as sluggish and slow as it did with a Mastery build when entering sub 35%.

I do see arguments for Mastery in regards to more stability and indeed AoE DPS but I haven't really seen this in a live environment. As stated I really do believe the difference is tangible and a matter of play-style.

#303 mckaguer

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 05:48 PM

Hey, running as assassination right now, quick question.

Is anyone else running a high crit build? Shadowcraft is now almost doubling my crit to get all 3 stats valued within 0.04. Trying to set me up at 9.8k Haste, 9k Crit and 5.9k mastery. Truthfully I've been slacking a little and not doing enough research, but still this is the first I've seen where crit is valued so much. So is anyone running with a set up like this, or being told to?

#304 thottstation

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:47 AM

As a combat Rogue, Shadowcraft insists that I replace ALL my Red/Orange Agility gems with Green/Yelllow Haste gems. Is that right, or have I made a mistake in the settings somewhere?

#305 Wally1169

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 12:10 PM

As a combat Rogue, Shadowcraft insists that I replace ALL my Red/Orange Agility gems with Green/Yelllow Haste gems. Is that right, or have I made a mistake in the settings somewhere?


Whenever a secondary stat is greater than half of agility (also say, for example: 2haste > 1agi), SC will recommend the secondary stat. Your haste, pre re-gem, is 2.054 and your agi is 2.785, so that's way more than half of agility. Even after the re-gem, when haste drops to about 1.8, you still well over half. As has been said many times in various threads in this forum, your mileage may vary - the haste focus may work better for you, or may not.

#306 swswsw

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 12:38 AM

what's the current deal with AoC? I've only got the flex version but I've been holding off on Vendetta to pair up with Shadow Blades. Is this correct or am I losing DPS? Should I just use them on cooldown?

#307 Ireath

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 11:45 AM

what's the current deal with AoC? I've only got the flex version but I've been holding off on Vendetta to pair up with Shadow Blades. Is this correct or am I losing DPS? Should I just use them on cooldown?


Generally, you can delay Vendetta (or any CD) if you don't lose the chance of using it an additional time during that encounter.

#308 nordveien

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Posted 13 October 2013 - 08:10 PM

1. How does one approach estimating how much better Sub is on single target than other specs?
It's not recommended to compare dps between different specs in Shadowcraft, and SimCraft never worked well for rogues (compared to Shadowcraft anyway). Last tier, the common knowledge that Assn was "bigger than" other specs was, to my understanding, verified by overwhelming empirical evidence; everyone who could play, say, both Assn and Combat equally well, could switch and notice that Assn was definitely doing more damage. This tier, as I understand, the advantage of Sub is not as prominent, and even WoL does not yet support the premise of Sub being ahead.

2. How can one compare which burst is bigger, Sub or Combat, over, say, a window of 20 seconds? So both Combat has time to burn both KS and AR+SB, and Sub can do its thing (Premed, Vanish, ShD).
In the recent thread dedicated to Sub, it is mentioned that

Combat that rapidly alternates between high damage spikes and low troughs ... Subtlety's damage curve is relatively smooth over the course of the fight

Doesn't it follow that Combat's burst is bigger (since it causes high spikes, and Sub's burst, which appears at roughly the same intervals (base 1 min, modified by AoC), doesn't)?

#309 Palanuial

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 01:19 PM

I'd suggest looking at the 'dps-timeline' that simC shows if you want to know more about how the damage of a given spec varies throughout a fight.

#310 MasterofVirus

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Posted 30 October 2013 - 07:48 PM

Question: What gives more DPS. Combine Synapse Springs with KS or with AR + SB?

 

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#311 Geoffar

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 01:21 PM

So, I'm not sure if I'm just not really willing to be almost 2.5% under Expertise cap as Assassination, or if Shadowcraft is leading me astray. Should i be that far under the expertise cap or should i be trying for the cap or close to it?



#312 Markasaurus

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Posted 14 November 2013 - 10:22 PM

I'm a Combat Rogue and currently have Immaculate Pandaren Axe of the Windstorm upgraded to 2 as MH and Hvitserk's Formidable Shanker upgraded to 2 as OH.  Today during raiding Norushen's Shortblade dropped.  The ilvl jump between the axe and the Shortblade dagger is huge and I know I'm supposed to always use a 2.6s MH but is this ilvl jump worth using the Shortblade dagger in the MH slot over the axe? 


Edited by Markasaurus, 14 November 2013 - 10:26 PM.


#313 Grimwolf

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 12:10 AM

@Geoffar I've always trusted ShadowCraft and didn't worry about expertise. It's easy to keep your rotation clean without it. But this week I manually adjusted the stats to cap hit and exp, and ShadowCraft showed a dps increase of roughly 500. Not much, but it is something. Bottom line is whichever way you want to play it, there isn't that much of a difference.



#314 Geoffar

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Posted 15 November 2013 - 12:41 AM

@Grimwolf, I figured out what the problem was and I feel stupid. Since I didn't have the legendary meta gem yet Shadowcraft was not having me reforge to expertise but since I got it today I checked Shadowcraft and I'm now .02% under the cap. I was previously following Shadowcraft before the gem but my dps just felt off. Its now where i think it should be.



#315 Rerox

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 10:13 AM

The ilvl jump between the axe and the Shortblade dagger is huge and I know I'm supposed to always use a 2.6s MH but is this ilvl jump worth using the Shortblade dagger in the MH slot over the axe? 

Simply: No, it's not worth it and doesn't make sense.

If you want to make the most out of the drop, switch your spec to Assassination and use Shortblade MH, Hvitserk OH.

If you want to stay Combat, keep the Axe MH and use the Shortblade OH.


Edited by Rerox, 26 November 2013 - 10:14 AM.


#316 Rigapples

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 02:32 PM

This might be silly but I didn't see the answer anywhere.

 

This tier we often pop hero on the pull.  With Pots/Trinkets/CDs at the start, I wind up capping energy very often if I try to use my blindside procs.  Is it better in this case to just ignore the proc and continue to spam Mutilate?  I don't want to energy cap, and Mutilate will give more CPs (and therefore more Envenoms to spam).   It also costs more energy so I don't wind up capping.

 

If using Dispatch on a blindside proc during hero would cause energy cap, should we still use it?



#317 Enzo90910

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Posted 20 December 2013 - 02:39 PM

If using Dispatch on a blindside proc during hero would cause energy cap, should we still use it?

 

I'm pretty sure Dispatch's whole point is better DPE. In any case of energy capping, Mutilate should be prioritized for its better DPS. For example, the same reasoning mostly applies to Vanish's reopener while under 35% HP I believe: making Dispatch cheaper is not as interesting as making Mutilate cheaper and therefore you should open with Mutilate after a Vanish.


Edited by Enzo90910, 20 December 2013 - 02:40 PM.


#318 Xenosynn

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Posted 06 January 2014 - 04:45 AM

At what % should you stop reforging or geming mastery? (assassination) I had a 97% rating before I got some new gear and it droped down to about 85%. I wasn't sure if I should go crazy and get it back up or at a certain point does it actually cap.



#319 Palanuial

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Posted 06 January 2014 - 06:06 AM

There is no magic number.



#320 Launchd

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Posted 07 February 2014 - 09:28 PM

So I've come back to the game from a break. I'm not a mediocre player by any means and have been in my fair share of hardcore progression guilds over the course of this game. With that being said, I feel as if my DPS is subpar and is holding me back. It's to the point that I'm not comfortable joining Flex 4 - Norm SoO groups because of it. This of course is preventing me from obtaining crucial upgrades. I'm pulling around 145k-180k on most encounters and I'm following my rotation to the best of my abilities.. A lot of people tell me it's due to the fact I don't have my Meta yet, my weapons are LFR - not flex (bad luck) and I'm playing the wrong spec. I realize the last bit may be opinionated quite a bit though and I really do enjoy assassination. At this point though I'm open to suggestion/ideas.

 

 

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