Jump to content


Photo

[Resto] Mists of Pandaria 5.4


  • Please log in to reply
1310 replies to this topic

#21 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 26 September 2012 - 03:48 PM

Will make updates when I have chance here in a bit. Likely this afternoon, but I should get to them today.

e: I ran far later pushing to 90 tonight than I thought. I will update in the morning.
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter

#22 Hamlet

Hamlet

    Mike Tyson

  • • Guide Author
  • 11,567 posts

Posted 26 September 2012 - 03:49 PM

Doesn't matter when, I was just leaving notes when I had a chance :P .

#23 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 27 September 2012 - 01:47 PM

  • Noted for completeness that Renewal doesn't take a GCD.
  • Noted Ursol's Vortex can be used at range and the other two abilities in that tier cannot.
  • Updated description of spellpower as Int no longer gives "mana gains."
  • Added note in Mastery section re: confirmation.
  • Clarified Breakpoint table to be more clear.
  • Simplified discussion of first breakpoint.
  • Clarified information on socket bonuses.
  • Removed Greater Haste from boot enchants.
  • Updated Spirit Note on Alchemy and JC professions to indicate that the Int option is stronger of the two.
  • Clarified note on Clearcasting Proc.
  • Removed wrath from ToL discussion.
  • Simplified Symbioses Table.

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter

#24 yaim0310

yaim0310

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 1 posts

Posted 27 September 2012 - 05:23 PM

I love the SotF healing style of Swiftmend then using the 50% on Wild Growth, going along with the new 4p making this even better.

So I was thinking about the Haste Breakpoints for Wild Growth while doing that, I don't know the exact math for it. However, if we get the 12.51% for rejuv at the start, we'll have 62.51% haste on Wild Growth right? Correct me if I'm wrong, Wild Growth's ticks are half of 1/base_ticks for the first extra and just 1/base_ticks for every other extra tick. So this is what I'm getting:

8th - 0.5/7 = 7.142%
9th - +1/7 = 21.428%
10th - +1/7 = 35.714%
11th - +1/7 = 50%
12th - +1/7 = 64.285%

So going for the rejuv breakpoint with SotF, we are just shy of the next Wild Growth tick at 64.285%. I currently don't know anything about how wow does the rounding so these numbers are most likely inaccurate, but wouldn't going for a little bit more haste be worth it for the tick?

#25 Hamlet

Hamlet

    Mike Tyson

  • • Guide Author
  • 11,567 posts

Posted 27 September 2012 - 06:09 PM

%-based haste buffs are multiplicative, so the math will work out differently, but the idea is good. Will see where any WG-with-SotF breakpoints land when I have time.

#26 Hamlet

Hamlet

    Mike Tyson

  • • Guide Author
  • 11,567 posts

Posted 27 September 2012 - 06:54 PM

Whatever, here's a quick and dirty. 5730 and 9543 are the relevant ones.

#27 Albel

Albel

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 6 posts

Posted 27 September 2012 - 07:35 PM

Earen, you forgot the new belt buckle. Furthermore players with herbalism have a chance to loot Water Spirits. I've heard they do not share a cooldown with normal potions. Maybe someone can confirm or refute that.

#28 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 28 September 2012 - 01:55 AM

Updated. Please let me know if you think I need to clarify the SotF breakpoints better.

e: Also, if anyone can confirm the mana pot/Water Spirit thing, that would be great.
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter

#29 Kjeldorian

Kjeldorian

    Piston Honda

  • Members
  • 119 posts

Posted 28 September 2012 - 03:00 AM

@ Water Spirit - They did share a CD with Pots on Beta, you can gather them while gathering your plants doing Tiller dailies as a non-herbalist.

<Reserve for live testing of the breakpoints, my prediction is off by 10-15 points which may possibly be rounding errors on my part>

Though my predictions + beta character sheet matched up.

#30 Kjeldorian

Kjeldorian

    Piston Honda

  • Members
  • 119 posts

Posted 28 September 2012 - 05:15 PM

Obtained one on live, did some logging for about an hour in heroics, shortest duration between procs was 15 sec for 5082 mana with most procs occurring every 16-20 seconds. This results in an MP5 equivalent between 1271 (ICD avg 20 seconds) to 1694 mp5 (15 seconds). Given how this mana return is greater than any of the other available trinkets by a factor of two, I do not expect the ICD to remain that way for long.

#31 Ryûjin

Ryûjin

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 1 posts

Posted 30 September 2012 - 10:59 AM

Obtained one on live, did some logging for about an hour in heroics, shortest duration between procs was 15 sec for 5082 mana with most procs occurring every 16-20 seconds. This results in an MP5 equivalent between 1271 (ICD avg 20 seconds) to 1694 mp5 (15 seconds). Given how this mana return is greater than any of the other available trinkets by a factor of two, I do not expect the ICD to remain that way for long.


Got the same results. In a 5m fight it was about 1400 mp5. Seems way too strong compared to the other trinkets.

#32 Payday

Payday

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 42 posts

Posted 01 October 2012 - 07:54 PM

Will it be worth going above 3043 haste for the extra Regrowth ticks at 5730 and 6652 when gear capable of those numbers is available? It seems a druid would have to specifically gear for near pure haste to achieve that mark, while reducing our efficiency with rejuvenation. Putting that extra value (~3600) into mastery instead gains about 7.5% potency on all of our HoTs and thusly improves efficiency.

As we gain regen, we will use less nourish and regrowth is fast already, so any bonus to general casting speed will diminish and our percentage of healing via HoTs will increase making mastery more important. Until we are at a gear point where it's difficult to not have 6652 haste I don't think we'll benefit as much from haste as we will from mastery once beyond the 3043 break.

#33 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 01 October 2012 - 08:51 PM

No. Once you are at the 3043 breakpoint, you do not want to give up other stats for haste until such time that you can achieve the 5730 (with SotF) or 6652. As stated, haste becomes our weakest stat outside of breakpoints. The important breakpoints to reach are for Rejuv and Wild Growth.

e: I think I am confused by your commentary, as there are not Regrowth breakpoints at the numbers listed, and I think you mean Rejuv/WG. In time, I feel that gear may lend itself to supporting the higher breakpoints without too much trouble. I could be wrong, and if our gear never gets to that point, then you will stay at the lower breakpoint. However, if it does become possible, it will be worth the effort to achieve them.
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter

#34 Payday

Payday

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 42 posts

Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:02 PM

Sorry for any confusion. When I say beyond 3043, I don't mean between break points. I mean beyond 3043 is the 6652 break point worth the loss of efficency (both mana and cast time) and loss of significant mastery (and perhaps spirit). How much healing does an extra tick of Wild Growth give us compared to 7.5% additional healing on all HoTs (including Wild Growth).

I haven't constructed my BiS list yet as I'm still working on obtaining my pre-raid set. 6652 may be possible in this first epic tier, but it would likely mean gearing for pure haste. Perhaps in the future (T15/16) it may be possible to achieve 6652 in a trivial fashion while not sacrificing too much in other stats making that break more attractive. At the same time though, with improved gear comes enough regen, that we will no longer be casting as much nourish and relying more on HoTs and Regrowth, which doesn't benefit much from haste, especially when glyphed.

My underlying question to all of this is will it ever benefit us to equip more than 3043 haste at any gear level in this expansion? Unless we can reach 13426 haste to gain the group of bonus ticks from 12834 to 13426 I question the loss of mastery and efficiency when going above 3043 and below 13426.

#35 magiama9

magiama9

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 7 posts

Posted 01 October 2012 - 10:34 PM

Hi there! I was looking at the list of trinkets that we'll be looking for, and noticed some inconsistencies with your listing for the Darkmoon Card trinket, . You list it as having 956 static intellect, while the version that went live has 1157 intellect.

If it stays at 1157 intellect and 750 odd MP5, it will easily be one of our best trinkets through regular raiding and possibly a good second trinket choice for regen in heroic raids. It beats out and rather handily.

Personally, I expect to be using and the DMC trinket for regen well into the first tier. I'll test out my DMC trinket once the faire opens and report back.

#36 Dummy

Dummy

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 12 posts

Posted 01 October 2012 - 11:16 PM

I haven't constructed my BiS list yet as I'm still working on obtaining my pre-raid set. 6652 may be possible in this first epic tier, but it would likely mean gearing for pure haste. Perhaps in the future (T15/16) it may be possible to achieve 6652 in a trivial fashion while not sacrificing too much in other stats making that break more attractive. At the same time though, with improved gear comes enough regen, that we will no longer be casting as much nourish and relying more on HoTs and Regrowth, which doesn't benefit much from haste, especially when glyphed.

My underlying question to all of this is will it ever benefit us to equip more than 3043 haste at any gear level in this expansion? Unless we can reach 13426 haste to gain the group of bonus ticks from 12834 to 13426 I question the loss of mastery and efficiency when going above 3043 and below 13426.


As you mentioned one big issue is that you sacrifice a lot of other stats, if it is just crit and mastery that is completly fine, but if you cut into spirit or even int to reach the haste cap the haste cap will not be as good anymore.

the other thing you should recognise is that, as mentioned above, haste between those breakpoints is very weak, so until you reach your desired gear it will be relativly "bad", as you can only reforge so much, that then the progress is probably over anyway.

imho the higher breakpoints will become interesting in future raiding tiers, but not just now

#37 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 02 October 2012 - 12:13 AM

Hi there! I was looking at the list of trinkets that we'll be looking for, and noticed some inconsistencies with your listing for the Darkmoon Card trinket, . You list it as having 956 static intellect, while the version that went live has 1157 intellect.


Fixed.
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter

#38 Venomous

Venomous

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 25 posts

Posted 02 October 2012 - 01:36 PM

1. Would love to drum up some discussion on Professions for us Resto Druids - I know the general rule of thumb is they are all 'similar' expect for JC which I believe has become the 'weaker' of the non-gathering professions. It seems that Blacksmithing is now a no-brainier as secondary stats have become so valuable, but for the 2nd profession I'm having a tough time deciding.

Many are of the opinion of Tailoring, but I am concerned with it being a 'proc' rather then a straight static value - has anyone been through what I am/done some further hard maths :)?

2. With Season 12 going live now, what pieces would you suggest aiming for pre-raiding? I see you listed a few PvP pieces in the OP, but a few Spirit pieces are missing - is there an order we should look at purchasing these, maybe the 2pc over the misc Rings/Amulets?

#39 Kjeldorian

Kjeldorian

    Piston Honda

  • Members
  • 119 posts

Posted 02 October 2012 - 07:18 PM

PvP set-

The two piece (500 PvP power) is worthless the four piece is valuable (30 second IB, 13 sec SM)

Gearing for the WG breakpoint at 6k is doable but at a huge cost to spirit, it's safer to go with the 3k RJ breakpoint until you acquire enough gear and experience to lose spirit.

#40 Earen

Earen

    Likes Peachbellinis!

  • • Guide Author
  • 170 posts

Posted 02 October 2012 - 09:23 PM

We’re working to adjust current Justice and Honor gear to better align with intended values. Currently it’s more lucrative to run Battelgrounds for ilvl 464 epics, and convert all Justice to Honor to gear up. While some crossover is fine, the most optimal way to gear for PvE doesn’t make sense to happen through PvP.

This hotfix will ideally go out today, and once applied will change all Justice and Honor items (including those already purchased) in the following ways:

Justice Items
Current – ilvl 450 Rare
New – ilvl 458 Rare

Honor Items
Current – ilvl 464 Epic
New – ilvl 458 Rare

We’ll be increasing the PvP Power and Resilience on the Honor items by 15% to compensate for this change.

Again, our design in Mists of Pandaria is to allow for a greater degree of crossover between PvE and PvP using the same gear, but the original item levels simply made Honor gear (through Battlegrounds or conversion of Justice to Honor) a far better route to gear up for PvE. Players who enjoy PvE shouldn’t feel forced to PvP to get the best gear, and vice versa.


This may devalue the PvP gear some, even with the set bonuses. Will have to look at what the new stats look like once they are finished.
Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. ~ Eleanor Roosevelt

is recruiting! Learn More About Two Night a Week Progression!

Blog | YouTube | Twitter




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users