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[WW] 5.4 -Siege of the Fist


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#901 Nevernite

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 09:06 AM

Is it considered a dps upgrade if, for instance on garrosh, to use storm earth and fire on the adds before spinning crane kicking, tiger palming and RSK beforehand obviously?


Uhm, I believe I tested the clones in 5.3 and it seemed, that they don't do more dmg because YOU have the Tiger Palm Buff. You have to Tiger Palm once after you summoned your clones and after they are on their target(not still midair jumping to the target). They need to copy the Tiger Palm to get their OWN buff - then they do get the Tiger Palm benefit.

Unless they changed it in 5.4 .. I got some testing to do.


Maximizing your SEF-usage grants very good damage. But you have to bear in mind when it's worth it to summon your clone and when not. If my above written text is still true, you have to concider a little dps loss at first. Clone does no dmg while jumping to the target and does less dmg while their own TP buff is not up. But in the longer run it will pay off.

PS: I still wish the targets attacked by a clone would get some kind of buff so you can track which targets are attacked by clones and don't sacrifice damage while accidentally attacking the same target.

#902 Asune

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 01:11 PM

PS: I still wish the targets attacked by a clone would get some kind of buff so you can track which targets are attacked by clones and don't sacrifice damage while accidentally attacking the same target.


If you use weakauras there's a very good one for tracking SEF clones somebody over on the MMO-Champ forums made.

Storm, Earth, and Fire WeakAura

#903 Nevernite

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 10:23 AM

Well, looks like I should eventually say goodbye to PowerAurasClassic and get friendly with WeakAura.
Thanks Asune. This will definitely proof useful.
edit// ok, sry for being slightly offtopic, but I found a standalone addon version:
Storm, Earth, and Fire - Monk - World of Warcraft Addons - Curse

#904 Eyedore

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 03:30 PM

ok, sry for being slightly offtopic, but I found a standalone addon version:
Storm, Earth, and Fire - Monk - World of Warcraft Addons - Curse


I use that one too, I like the fact it gives various sound effects when you target a spirit's target, and when a spirit dies/despawns. For the rest it looks to be very similar to the weakaura one, only the hp of the spirit isn't tracked.

#905 Arathius

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:18 PM

So after doing some more heroic progression here are a few little tips and tricks Ive found in case people aren't aware.

Sha- Ascendance by your spot on the prison. Makes breaking it a cinch. You can easily re-drop it in the half second while waiting for people to get there.

Galakras- On top of being prime candidates for ccing the grunt for tower groups you can chain disable the first add to root him for about a second. The root will break, but has no diminishing and can continually be applied to the first grunt of each tower. Ascendance will make an easy transition to moving Flames behind the assigned group if you choose to use it.

Juggernaut- Lots of reliable damage early on in the fight so using a first Touch of Karma offensively is easy. For siege mode you can cd every shock pulse and dont have to worry about anything. 1-Fort Brew/ToK, 2- Diffuse Magic, 3- Zen Med. If you get a second siege phase they should be off cooldown so rinse and repeat. Unsure if Zen Med redirects any damage or not.

Dark Shaman- If you get Foul Stream targeting you and you are using a strat that requires you to move out of the melee group do not roll, walk. It is the same concept as jump movement where your calculated position does not move till the roll is finished. If not done immediately you risk not moving the stream. (happened to me twice as I wasnt aware of that issue at first and the first time I assumed it was a latency issue of sorts)

#906 Ronark

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:48 AM

Dark Shaman- If you get Foul Stream targeting you and you are using a strat that requires you to move out of the melee group do not roll, walk. It is the same concept as jump movement where your calculated position does not move till the roll is finished. If not done immediately you risk not moving the stream. (happened to me twice as I wasnt aware of that issue at first and the first time I assumed it was a latency issue of sorts)


You can use Roll in the reverse concept, to roll through say Ashen Wall and not take damage.
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#907 Eyedore

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 02:18 PM

At Nuroshen when doing your test, make use of your Storm, Earth, Fire. Put a copy on 2 small adds and kill the third small add or the big add yourself, depending on if you need to kill your big add first or last. This way they go down super fast and if you need to kill the big add last the ground aoe isn't as annoying while trying to kill the small ones.
Also in the boss room if there are many adds or you know that there will be, put 1 copy on the boss while you focus on the adds, remove it once everything is cleared again.

#908 Arathius

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Posted 09 October 2013 - 08:38 AM

You can use Roll in the reverse concept, to roll through say Ashen Wall and not take damage.


Actually hadnt thought of that but certainly useful to know. I still wouldnt advise it because the wall has a decent melee range and you would have to get fairly close to make sure you dont get hit on the backside of the roll. Good for oh sh#$ moments. Harrom can be disarmed so it is always worth doing if you see a tank dropping lower, or just as a general dps cd to line up with TeB/procs. 5% for 15 seconds certainly is nothing to scoff at.

Also Zen Med does work to redirect damage from Iron Jug. I noticed it getting eaten through fairly quickly during siege and when popping it before Shock Pulse went out it would be out of charges by the time I landed 1 sec later. I didnt comb through logs much but it seemed to be redirecting damage from puddles people were in.

#909 Ronark

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 03:09 AM

If you rely on the technique as a crutch, you can always use Chi Roll as well because it propels you farther.
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#910 Arathius

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 08:04 PM

With the strategy most groups are using to kill h shaman you seperate harrom and should never have to deal with ashen wall because the tank faces him into the corner and slowly backs up from each wall

#911 Jazzyy

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 08:20 PM

Is there a spreadsheet for 5.4 WW Monk trinkets?

#912 Saltycracker

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Posted 16 October 2013 - 04:53 AM

So, I maek spreadsheet.

Basics:
-I took the ability damages from my character as it appears on the armory atm. Boss buffs/debuffs/sunders dont really change the answers too much. This isnt raid DPS, but if I was attacking a 0 armor dummy, no trinkets and no dancing steel procs.
-Based on a typical minute rotation, and 58 GCDs per minute. In each case I did my best to balance ability usage as close as I could to that 58 GCD cap. 58 GCDs is a good number per minute based on encounter demands, cooldown usage, SEF usage blah blah
-Ascension. I don't think the answer changes with Chi Brew, but if someone thinks that it does let me know.
-If something doesn't make sense, or look right, maek poast.

https://docs.google....drive_web#gid=0

No tier bonuses:

2 FOF/min:
Damage/Min 15,656,896
DPS 260,948

BOK Spam:
Damage/Min 15,669,708
DPS 261,162

.9992 FOF = BOK Spam

39% AOC:
Damage/Min 16,478,442
DPS 274,641

AOC = 1.0525 BOK Spam

4pc:

2 FOF/min:
Damage/Min 15,911,337
DPS 265,189

BOK Spam:
Damage/Min 15,939,818
DPS 265,664

.9982 FOF = BOK Spam

39% AOC:
Damage/Min 16,731,314
DPS 278,855

AOC = 1.0515 BOK Spam

Bottom line, FOF is neither a gain nor a loss given perfect integration into your rotation, and all your ticks hit. If the boss moves, or you have to, FOF is a suboptimal choice. If you are at an energy hole in your rotation, or you feel confident that you can get a complete channel off, use it. There is no penalty nor gain to do so.

AOC: Given perfect integration into your rotation, the 39% cooldown reduction is worth about 5% bonus DPS. That 5% assumes perfect FOF integration into your rotation and 100% FOF efficiency. Keep in mind, this 5% is just the value of the CD reduction, and should be compared to other trinkets in only the multistrike effect, or the mastery gained from TED, since the agi procs on all 3 trinkets are mostly comparable.

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Monk Windwalker Spreadsheet - https://docs.google....RsNVJSZlE#gid=6
WW 5.4 PTR Spreadsheet - hhttps://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Anhp6CgrSES9dFJFVk11S3lrNldPNXNnelhPVVN6aXc#gid=2

#913 Ruga

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 07:44 AM

I think there's been a hotfix that's not listed in the notes (as of 17.10.2013):

When using Expel Harm before you get into combat to get free 2 Chi used to cause Dancing Steel to proc.
This seems to not happen anymore. You can use EH just before combat starts now without the worry of wasting Dancing Steel seconds.

I'm wondering if anyone else noticed this or if I'm just "lucky" (cleared 1-11 heroic last night and I never had Dancing Steel Proc before combat) with not getting procs.

#914 Ronark

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 08:57 AM

Were you reliably getting procs on the pull? I don't think they made Dancing Steel work like Jikuns Feather to not always proc on the pull; I can do a quick check with EH and also use my Paladin's Dancing Steel to validate if it includes all healing spells tomorrow.
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#915 Ruga

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 10:10 AM

I was getting them constantly, yes.
Even using EH in Shrine made DS proc.

During ToT HC Progress I refrained from using it right before the pull for instance.
I just recently noticed it while doing Thok Heroic and trying to optimize here and there.

You can look at it here in my Lei Shen Heroic kill:

Kill Loot Repeat vs Lei Shen 25m Heroic - YouTube

Top left are my buffs and the Chi is above my character frame. You can see the Dancing Steel Proc the second I use EH and well before Lei Shen teleports to us and we begin the fight.

I haven't started editing our Thok kill together yet, but once I'm done I can show it so you see the difference.

#916 Nevernite

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 11:16 AM

I was getting them constantly, yes.
Even using EH in Shrine made DS proc.


I can confirm that, too. Even got double procs with two 1-handers.

#917 Ruga

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Posted 23 October 2013 - 07:16 AM

  • General
    • Tigereye Brew and Mana Tea gains from Chi Brew now correctly benefit from Mastery: Bottled Fury and Brewing: Mana Tea.

    Well, that explains why I "felt" that my TEB was building up more fluently yesterday during our Siegecrafter HC attempts.Wonder if this would slightly change the Mastery value for us.



#918 Eyedore

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Posted 23 October 2013 - 10:59 AM

Hey fellow Windwalkers,

 

Until now I was still using Ascension, but I want to swap to Chi Brew. I'd like to know what abilities you guys use and in what order at the pull?

I came up with this one myself:

 

EH before pull

FSK to the boss

RSK

Jab

TP

Chi Brew & BoK

Jab

BoK

Jab

BoK

Chi Brew & TeB & RSK

 

This is ofcourse when you get no Combo Breaker procs, otherwise leave a Jab & BoK out.

The thing I'm interested in most is when you use the initial 2 Chi Brew charges, cause with this setup I'm capping energy if I get Combo Breaker procs.

 

Also, do you think this is a good time to use TeB? the good thing is my stacks will be almost at 10, or close, because I use it after the 2 Chi Brew charges (and before the 2nd RSK). The downside is that my trinket procs are almost falling off at this time.



#919 Arathius

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 10:05 PM

Generally I can fit in a single Chi Brew after my tiger palm and rsk on the opener. Its off the global so make sure you hit it directly after your rsk and it should let you get that bok->jab in before you cap energy.

My usual opener barring combo breaker procs looks like: Jab->Tiger Palm->Chi Brew->BoK->Jab->RsK->Chi Brew->Bok. Atm I have just under 9k haste and Im able to do that without energy capping. It works well with BL on pull fights so we can have TeB up almost immediately.

On another note I found an interesting interaction with Spirit Link Totem and Touch of Karma: http://worldoflogs.c.../?s=1275&e=1383

 

Apparently if you ToK as spirit link is dropped it will deal heavily increased damage because of the way spirit link distributes health. I noticed this on Thok last night and after testing it a few times it did the same basic thing every time. On some pulls I was getting ticks of ToK for over 600k per second. 



#920 Crevan

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 10:38 PM

It's very likely that the ToK behaviour was due to a bug that apparently was introduced with the Chi Brew hotfix last week: the buff on you would not disappear unless you took a single hit for more than your hp pool, meaning you could keep absorbing and reflecting all medium to small hits for full 10 seconds. As far as I'm aware, the bug has been fixed now.


Edited by Crevan, 28 October 2013 - 10:38 PM.





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