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#1 Jessamy

Jessamy

    Struck by Diax's Rake

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 12:19 AM

Post: Blood Tanking - Actively Mitigating since before it was cool
User: TheScorned
Infraction: Multiple violations.
Points: 0

Administrative Note:

Message to User:

Rule 4: Your parenthetical comment about Blizzard and your bowdlerized epithet ("b.......") is inappropriate. Don't do that.

Rule 6: I'm happy for you that you're so enthusiastic about your class and eager to share your perspective. But your first two paragraphs introducing yourself aren't needed. Just jump right in and say what you have to say.

Original Post:

[Edited for more clarity]

Hi people,

First of all, I am NOT the famous Scorned (stealer) that owns Challenges and Proving Grounds alike. I'm just a Belgian with average skills that loves his class.

I've been following EJ almost since it exists and based most of my characters' builds around the sane and Ô so wonderful mathematical approach that you guys have been advocating with much courage. This is my first post on your forums and it is to express much respect and yet a certain disconfort around the stat-weight of Blood DK in 10 man raiding that everyone recommends.

I'm posting to push further Tyvi's and Raegwynn's tips towards enhancing your dps as a tank. I know it's redundant with many former posts but I'm trying to write it down in one post to try and clarify the big picture behing all of this : I don't think we need tanking gear ... at all !

I've cleaned ToT HM and SoO Normal with full dps gear and that is quite the opposite of all the guides I have found. To me 10 man Blood Tanking revolves soundly around timings, death runes and Cooldowns and we can do that in dps gear all the way. And I think we should start to consider ourselves gearwise the same way that druids and monks do : convert dps gear in tank mecanics.

Sure a healthy amount of EHP and armor is required but once you get to the million health points, it's just not that good of a stat to chase. Dodge and Parry are NOT vital stats to stack. Endurance and Mastery emulates this almost the same. Pure Mastery stacking is redondant, it's just too high of a shield for too long of a time. And I mean this when I say : too good of a tank isn't a good thing when progressing. Most encounters have a short enrage or mecanics that rely on dps (Norushen for example).

As an example, my stat priorities are currently (550ish ilvl) :

Hit/Exp > Haste (cap = 20%) = Mastery (cap around 200%) > Crit (best DPS stats on blood DK) > Parry (I grab it on red gemslots when expertise caped)

Hit/Exp Cap : best DPS stats and quite easy to get with current gear.
Haste : I think we should see haste as "hardcapped" around 20%ish, even I am GCD locked after that and it doesn't provide much in term of dps and tanking after that. But it has been shown that perfect timing, no lag and perfect AMS soaking gives almost a GCD lock with a LOT less Haste.
Mastery : I stack it up to 200-225ish % even though you can do with a LOT less, but it's progress time and I like to max my shield in 2DS on most hard hiting encounters. I see it as a DPS stats in some way because if my shields are big enough I can spend more time on runestrikes/bloodboils and it gives more time for my healers to get me up so I can dps during that window.
Crit : It's the best stats for us once we reach confort zone. It affects all our dps skills and both our dots.
Parry : I get it naturally from red sockets and because Blood DK scales so badly with Attack Power I (personnally) rank it higher than strenght gem-wise. The new Riposte passive is a small benefit.

I find myself quite confortable (even Garrosh on P1 without usage of Stars with 2-3 adds on me all the time and the dude hits like a truck with a bad temper).

After months of thinking I came to the humble conclusion that Blizzard made 5 things that have shifted blood dk from wanting to gear towards tank stats vs gearing full dps (but still going for 4pc Tank T16 because they class locked the Tier bonuses, the b....... !).

1°) Brocken Items !!! First of all, the Legendary Tank Metagem ! It's too good. 20% reduction from all sources proc is insane and because the bosses are scaled upon players with same ilvl but no Legendary Questline items, this allows us to go without a LOT of tanking stats. Our T16 bonuses are actually excellent for once and dps oriented (That DRW is kick arse burst !). Strenght has a very good ratio with parry so we can even go with DPS trinkets without too much second thought. I mean hey even tank trinkets are awesome for DPS (I'm looking at you Thok's Tail Tip and Curse of Hubris). The Legendary Tanking Cloak is rubish in most cases (you can gimmick it but it's too much of a hassle and rarely worth it) while the Dps Cloak is a huge boon to dps (even with the proc nerf), it's almost 7% of my dps on ST and close to 13,5% on 3 targets and more and the stats are awesome !

2°) Bosses don't hit that hard and healers are really strong. When you see how a Restoration Druid can keep a raid full health almost GCD free or the amount of single target healing a Paladin can keep all fight long on you while taking care of dispels and raid healing, it's something you need to keep in mind. I'm able to solo tank Thok on Normal without much issues in full dps gear and he is (after Garrosh) one of the more damaging tank hiter on this tier (in P1 of course).

3°) 10 man tank dps is key in most situations on Heroic Mode 10 man and being able to have a stable 200-230K dps on single target is a huge step towards a down. Almost so much that Guilds would rather give a harder time on their healers than ask for more defensive oriented gear on their tanks (mine does).

4°) Most of our dps doesn't require many Death Runes usage (If you don't go the Death Siphon route). With 20% Haste, i'm almost GCD locked with 80% HS/RS/BB procs/D&D and timely used DS, so i can use mainly Blood Runes and Runic Power and have 4 Death Runes sitting for a few seconds if I know something big is coming. And on top of that all our DPS CDs have flash modified stats according to ours so we can even use our Army and Ghoul as much as possible as a defensive/offensive cooldown that scales dynamicaly with our vengeance (that sometimes goes sky high, I have exemples of 350-400K vengeance for whole minutes).

5°) We have so many defensive CDs it's ridiculous. AMS timing has never been so rewarding, most encounters run a 2-3 minute gaps between burst phases (Malkorok is 2m50 but hey just ask for a Pain Sup/Sacrifice) so we always have something up, we have a 60% self heal on a 2 minute cd and IBF glyphed is OP on most fights.

I find it harder and harder to guide people towards gearing with tank pieces and it's not some emulation of Tankadins (even though I outdps ours ...). I think that you lose a tiny bit of tanking stats and gain a massive dps. It simply outweights everything else if you think about it in a raid-centric fashion.

Now I really don't consider myself as a professional tank/player. I play my DK a lot, true, and I have great faith in my healers but we play casually and care-free and still get things done that way. So if even a player like me can run with those stat weights I think most players that care to read this awesome site would be able to also !

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that the DK Blood guide is misleading or have a bad approach, just that I think that DPS geared tanking is something that people start doing a lot and I don't think it's harder than tank geared tanking just requires more knowledge from fight and class mechanics.






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