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Restoration WotLK Talents and Discussion


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#1321 grayrest

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 06:07 AM

Do we know how dual Earthliving imbues work? Are they each rolled separately? So we'd have (glyphed) a 1 - (.75^2) = 43.75% chance to apply per target? Would that, in addition to the gains in spellpower / haste / crit from double Earthliving, double weapon enchants, and whatever stats you can score on an offhand adequately compensate you for the loss of Earth Shield, Riptide, and Tidal Waves? The idea of a substantial increase in the output of Earthliving is, at least, interesting.


Dual Earthliving

* Heal Power bonus stacks, both are affected by elemental weapons (no surprise)
* Earthliving proc does NOT stack. Buff is refreshed.
* When glyphed, procced 179 times in 419 LHW for a 42.72% proc rate


As far as item comparison, it looks like it'll be the +63 SP vs +25 Int. I don't have resto spreadsheets set up to answer the is it worth it question.

#1322 Awimbowee

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 02:08 PM

Please take a moment to visit the first page of this thead. I have posted a very rough draft of the new wiki for Resto Shaman. It draws heavily on posts made in this thread, especially by Pitbuller, Philondra and Durnitol. Daidalos is also a prime contributor. This version is probably riddled with mistakes and omissions (which I know you guys will catch).

Real life has limited my time on the forums. However, I would like to provide an updated guide to healing as a shaman. And I figure I better start working on it before the expansion hits and I spend every free moment leveling to 80.


Hi there. :)

My first post here.

I don't know if it's very interesting, but since the 3.0.2, I use for raids, combined with mixology. You need to be exalted at the Cenarion Expedition to learn it.

With mixology, the duration of this flask has doubled (like all other flasks), but it increases my intellect of around 95, which means more than 1500 mana points with Ancestral Knowledge.

In BC, this was really awesome with all the crits and regen consequences, but I didn't have the chance to try this flask on the beta with a lvl 80 player. I can't tell you if the amount of intel is really interesting for WotLK, but it may be useful to look at this. :)

Sorry for my bad english, thank you for reading me :)

#1323 Daidalos

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 03:04 PM

Dual Earthliving

* Heal Power bonus stacks, both are affected by elemental weapons (no surprise)
* Earthliving proc does NOT stack. Buff is refreshed.
* When glyphed, procced 179 times in 419 LHW for a 42.72% proc rate


As far as item comparison, it looks like it'll be the +63 SP vs +25 Int. I don't have resto spreadsheets set up to answer the is it worth it question.


That pretty much matches what I reported from the beta. I think its something more an enh shaman would be interested in since I don't see resto really being viable with dual wield spec. As far as sp vs int it would depend on if you need the mana from the int or not. IN pure HPS 63 SP is superior. I don't think any HEP can be reached quite yet until we get more raiding in at 80. SP now no longer helps with mana at all so its not a very good comparison until we get a feel for it.

With mixology, the duration of this flask has doubled (like all other flasks), but it increases my intellect of around 95, which means more than 1500 mana points with Ancestral Knowledge.

In BC, this was really awesome with all the crits and regen consequences, but I didn't have the chance to try this flask on the beta with a lvl 80 player. I can't tell you if the amount of intel is really interesting for WotLK, but it may be useful to look at this. :)


Actually all throughout BC I once I was in sunwell I would use distilled wisdom as my preferred Flask when I went all out. I hope there is a 80 replacement but I haven't heard of one so far.


One thing I've been wondering is what professions are people going for BC? I was LW and alch for the drums and pot mastery but now LW isn't looking all that exciting. The LW leg enchants are for melee/tanking so I'm thinking of switching to something but I can't decide what. Currently I'm thinking BS for the ability to add a socket to bracers and gloves but I'm not sure if thats really best since most all the BS patterns are plate.
Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets....0IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

#1324 Krypt0s

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 04:16 PM

Dual Earthliving

* Heal Power bonus stacks, both are affected by elemental weapons (no surprise)
* Earthliving proc does NOT stack. Buff is refreshed.
* When glyphed, procced 179 times in 419 LHW for a 42.72% proc rate


As far as item comparison, it looks like it'll be the +63 SP vs +25 Int. I don't have resto spreadsheets set up to answer the is it worth it question.


You'd also tack on 195 +healing to the Paper Cutter since you'll get an extra Earthliving imbue, as you mentioned. I think that'll always give an OH weapon an edge over the best caster OH. Your test also seems to reinforce that it's two independent rolls, which will be 43.75% chance to apply per target. The question is: Will nearly doubling our Earthliving application rate ultimately prove more useful than having Earth Shield, Tidal Waves, and Riptide? If we're accepting that our role is 90%+ CH spam, perhaps.

I also noticed that the second point in Blessing of the Eternals loses some value in this build, as with one point the chance to apply Earthliving to a target < 35% health is already 87.75%. Whether the 2% crit is better than the point in Nature's Blessing is something to spreadsheet.

Going one (ridiculously huge) step further, I remembered an old video of an elemental shaman who used Mental Quickness and raid buffs to achieve astronomical spell damage values. We could sacrifice even further in resto and use Mental Dexterity and Mental Quickness to convert Int --> AP --> spellpower. Something like this It's essentially twice the effect of Nature's Blessing, as well as converting all AP buffs (and attack power from offhands) into more spellpower. Yes, the change to buff stacking hurts this in a huge way, but I thought I'd still toss it out there. I'm pretty sure the loss of Improved Chain Heal is a bit too much though.

#1325 Fuulish

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 04:57 PM

With respect to the DW enh/resto hybrid spec, is there an assumption that this spec is to be combined with caster gear? Or would full enhance gear (with it's much higher ap than sp on healer gear) be a better net choice? Obviously the mana pool of enhance vs caster gear would need to be taken into consideration.

#1326 Vistol

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 06:34 PM

remove
Ohh great i have 8 Main tanks signed up again and 4 healers.

#1327 Roywyn

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 07:46 PM

I'm curious if anyone has any idea in regards to which faction(s) rep should be grinided out first? Should quests in some zones be skipped until regular dungeon rep gains have been capped out?

The problem you mention does not exist.

Reputation gains do not cap, at least not that I know of.
And you only gain reputation in high-level dungeons and all all heroics.


You also named Ebon Blade and linked Argent Crusade items in one sentence.
You'll get a lot of Ebon Blade reputation from regular questing, and quite some for Argent Crusade.
Wyrmrest is pretty much a pure Tabard dungeon grind however.
Chaotic Meta Gems in Cataclysm: http://elitistjerks....p2/#post1794256

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.c...ki/SampleOutput
The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks....0-post3191.html

And doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does since 3.1.

#1328 sovelis41

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 08:00 PM

One thing I've been wondering is what professions are people going for BC? I was LW and alch for the drums and pot mastery but now LW isn't looking all that exciting. The LW leg enchants are for melee/tanking so I'm thinking of switching to something but I can't decide what. Currently I'm thinking BS for the ability to add a socket to bracers and gloves but I'm not sure if thats really best since most all the BS patterns are plate.

Don't forget about the bracer enchants (and drums are still usable). I'm sticking with LW and Alchemy. Four hour flasks and that little extra boost from potions is still nice to have.
You pay for the whole chair, but you only need the edge.

#1329 Talaus-Mok'Nathal

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 09:19 PM

Don't forget about the bracer enchants (and drums are still usable). I'm sticking with LW and Alchemy. Four hour flasks and that little extra boost from potions is still nice to have.


While drums are currently usable, they won't be at 80, so that benefit from LW is gone. As far as what to switch to, don't worry about BS only having plate available. Blizzard seems pretty insistant that no profession be "required" and as such doesn't have any (or very few) patterns in the game that won't be upgradable in Naxx. The sockest will add an equivalent bonus to the rest of the professions currently, and will get even better when epic gems get released.

#1330 Daidalos

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 10:01 PM

Don't forget about the bracer enchants (and drums are still usable). I'm sticking with LW and Alchemy. Four hour flasks and that little extra boost from potions is still nice to have.

Yeah even with the bracer enchants I'm not that exited about LW. With the long cooldown on drums and the enchants being melee and tanking oriented it just seems like its not the best for a caster class. Anyone run some min max comparisons of the dif professions for a caster class?
Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets....0IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

#1331 Talaus-Mok'Nathal

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Posted 12 November 2008 - 11:43 PM

The leg work has been done. Here's a link to the post http://elitistjerks....32-post854.html. This posts assumes epic gems are introduced. Until that point, JC is the best, offering the same SP boost as every other profession along with customizability by being able to use different gems as well as using "colorless" gems to get socket/meta bonuses. With epic gems, BS becomes god and JC loses it's potency, offering an addition 2 gem sockets, which gives 8 more SP than any other profession, as well as the different gem customizability.

So, from a strict SP/stat viewpoint,
Before epic gems: JC>BS=Insc=Alch=Ench=LW
After epic gems: BS>Insc=Alch=Ench=LW>JC
Keeping in mind that BS & JC offer more choices than other professions (Alch also offers a choice as well with flask/elixir use)

#1332 Daidalos

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 03:19 PM

The leg work has been done. Here's a link to the post http://elitistjerks....32-post854.html. This posts assumes epic gems are introduced. Until that point, JC is the best, offering the same SP boost as every other profession along with customizability by being able to use different gems as well as using "colorless" gems to get socket/meta bonuses. With epic gems, BS becomes god and JC loses it's potency, offering an addition 2 gem sockets, which gives 8 more SP than any other profession, as well as the different gem customizability.

So, from a strict SP/stat viewpoint,
Before epic gems: JC>BS=Insc=Alch=Ench=LW
After epic gems: BS>Insc=Alch=Ench=LW>JC
Keeping in mind that BS & JC offer more choices than other professions (Alch also offers a choice as well with flask/elixir use)


Great post. I think that pretty much confirms my hunch about BS. Esp with the ability to pick whichever gem I prefer to fill in the created socket. The only downside I see to BS is that the BOP drops from instances have always been plate. I think we should include this info in the wiki. I'll bug skyhoof about it.
Restoration Shaman calculations:http://spreadsheets....0IWv3sPmcYnEJUg

#1333 Skyhoof

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 04:25 PM

Good idea. I'll add a section on professions. Also, we could use some testing on (although it may be a few days before anyone makes one).

1) Wowhead lists a 2% chance to proc. However, it also lists 2% for and the actual proc rate for IED was 5% (or 3.85% if you took the hidden 15-second cooldown into account).

2) Is there a hidden cooldown. IED had a 15-second cooldown.

Also, I think we can safely say at this point that is a bad choice for resto shaman. We gain much more benefit from +2% Intellect rather than +2% mana. All the other meta gems could have potential depending on how much mana we're using at Level 80, crit/talent specs and how much running boss fights require.

#1334 Roywyn

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 06:20 PM

Mana Restore - Spell - World of Warcraft and Mana Restore - Spell - World of Warcraft

The procs both list a 5% chance under their actual effect.

The equip buff description are 2% and 300 mana for both (the new one has 600, not 200), so that points at some copy-paste without thinking.
Makes the 15s ICD pretty likely.
Chaotic Meta Gems in Cataclysm: http://elitistjerks....p2/#post1794256

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.c...ki/SampleOutput
The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks....0-post3191.html

And doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does since 3.1.




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