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[WotLK] Warrior: Simple Questions/Simple Answers


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#1 Boethius

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 06:26 AM

Welcome to the Warrior Simple Questions thread. This thread is for all your simple questions which you expect to have simple answers and thus do not require their own thread.

Note that all forum rules still apply: we said simple questions, not stupid questions (which have no place on these forums). You're still expected to make a reasonable effort to find the answer yourself by searching and reading the threads and making use of spreadsheets and any other tools that may be available. If, however, you're fairly confident that your question is not easily answered with available information, but don't think it will generate sufficient discussion to require it's own thread, this is the place to ask.

#2 morimacil

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 09:46 AM

I was wondering if the amount of hit rating needed to be capped for yellow attacks stayed the same against a mob while leveling up.
What i mean is at level 70 against a lvl 73 mob, you would need 142 hit rating for 9% hit. Now obviously as you level up, you would need less than 9% hit rating, but you will also gain less hit % from each rating point.

So would 142 hit rating still allow you to be hitcapped against a lvl 73 mob when you are lvl 73?

#3 Prinsesa

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 10:05 AM

For your specific question, yes, 142 hit rating is still enough to get you hitcapped against a level 73, if you yourself are level 73.

142 hit rating is worth 7.22% hit at level 73, and since you have a 5% chance to miss against an even leveled mob, then you'd still be hit-capped.

In fact, 142 hit rating is greater than or equal to 5% hit up to level 78, so you should still be hit-capped until then assuming you don't fight anything higher.

At level 79, you'd need 153 hit rating to never miss against an equal-leveled mob, with 164 hit rating required at level 80.
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#4 Guest_Ambika_*

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 04:36 PM

Same question regarding expertise but in reference to a level 83 raid boss:

How much expertise will one need at level 80 to reduce the amount of parry/miss/etc chances.

#5 Steveharris

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Posted 13 November 2008 - 05:28 PM

Here's a post I saved before the forums reset. None of this work is mine, all credit to the original poster (whoever it was) etc.:

At level 80, against a level 83 mob:

Defense cap: 689 defense rating to be uncrittable

Single-wielding hit cap without Precision: 296 hit rating to remove the 9% miss rate.

Single-wielding hit cap with Precision: 197 hit rating to remove the 6% miss rate.

*Note that these two above caps will apply to single-wielding Prot Warriors, two-handed-wielding Arms Warriors, and the yellow hit cap of non-Titan's-Grip Fury Warriors

Dual-wielding white hit cap without Precision: 919 hit rating to remove the 28% miss rate.

Dual-wielding white hit cap with 3/3 Precision: 820 hit rating to remove the 25% miss rate.

Titan's Grip yellow hit cap without Precision: 460 hit rating to remove the 14% miss rate.

Titan's Grip yellow hit cap with Precision: 361 hit rating to remove the 11% miss rate.

EDIT: For expertise caps, assuming the cap is still a 6.5% dodge rate:

Without Weapon Mastery: 214 expertise rating to remove the 6.5% dodge rate (equal to 26 expertise skill)

With 2/2 Weapon Mastery: 148 expertise rating to remove the 4.5% dodge rate (equal to 18 expertise skill)

#6 stickychu

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 03:22 AM

nice thanks for reposting that Steve

I had a quick question about 2H Arms rotations:

I quit for almost 3 months and I just came back for xpac, since then Slam was changed and Bladestorm was added, and I would just like to know what kind of rotation arms warriors do now? Do we still pickup imp slam and incorporate that for best results? How do we fit bladestorm in there now? Sorry if this question shouldn't be in the simple questions thread :/

#7 Prinsesa

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 07:38 AM

Steveharris: I neglected to include Strength of Arms (SoA) in my expertise cap computations.

At level 80:

With no Weapon Mastery (WM) and no SoA, you need 214 expertise rating to remove the 6.5% dodge rate.
With no WM and 2/2 SoA, you need 181 expertise rating
With 2/2 WM and no SoA, you need 148 expertise rating
With 2/2 WM and 2/2 SoA, you need 115 expertise rating
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#8 Enova

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 07:40 AM

nice thanks for reposting that Steve

I had a quick question about 2H Arms rotations:

I quit for almost 3 months and I just came back for xpac, since then Slam was changed and Bladestorm was added, and I would just like to know what kind of rotation arms warriors do now? Do we still pickup imp slam and incorporate that for best results? How do we fit bladestorm in there now? Sorry if this question shouldn't be in the simple questions thread :/


Imp Slam is still the base of arms dps, and the rotation hasn't changed that much; except you'll be using Battle Stance for it. Pretty much the same, with 2 caveats. Refresh Rend whenever it's about to fall, and pop Overpower and Execute whenever they're up.

In summary, TBC raiding is easy. 9/10 encounters can be summarized with 1 phrase. Stay out of the fucking fire. If this is too difficult BWL was still there last I checked, so go have at it for some practice.


You people are idiots

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#9 Bluefish

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 03:13 PM

I put the caps into a table and expanded it to try and head off "Do math for me!" questions. Numbers were pulled from the Combat Ratings thread. Anybody see any mistakes?

These numbers are vs. level 83 (boss) mobs. The common ones are arrowed for visibility.

Hit Caps
  Single 2H or 1H WHITE...........164 (5% hit) - ?
    w/Draenei.....................132 (4% hit) - ?
    w/Precision...................99  (3% hit) - ?
    w/Draen + Prec................66  (2% hit) - ?
->Single 2H or 1H YELLOW..........296 (9% hit)
    w/Draenei.....................263 (8% hit)
    w/Precision...................197 (6% hit)
    w/Draen + Prec................164 (5% hit)

  Dual Wield WHITE................919 (28% hit)
    w/Draenei.....................886 (27% hit)
    w/Precision...................820 (25% hit)
    w/Draenei + Prec..............788 (24% hit)
  Titan's Grip YELLOW.............460 (14% hit)
    w/Draenei.....................427 (13% hit)
->  w/Precision...................361 (11% hit)
    w/Draen + Prec................328 (10% hit)
Expertise (dodge) cap.............214 (26 Exp)
    +3 Racial.....................189 (23 Exp)
->  Strength of Arms 2/2..........181 (22 Exp)
    +5 Racial.....................173 (21 Exp)
->  Vitality 3/3..................164 (20 Exp)
    SoA & +3 Racial...............156 (19 Exp)
->  Weapon Mastery 2/2............148 (18 Exp)
    SoA & +5 Racial...............140 (17 Exp)
    Vit & +3 Racial...............140 (17 Exp)
    Vit & +5 Racial...............123 (15 Exp)
    WM & +3 Racial................123 (15 Exp)
    SoA & WM......................115 (14 Exp)
    WM & +5 Racial................107 (13 Exp)
    SoA & WM & +3 Racial..........82  (10 Exp)
    SoA & WM & +5 Racial..........66  (8 Exp)
Defense for uncrittable...........689 (? Def)

Edit: Remembered about Draenei.

#10 Moogul

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 05:18 PM

Single 2h or 1h white hits should be the same as yellow (non-TG) hits, I believe, so 9% base.
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#11 Saizul

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 09:37 PM

Ok, I have one!

Looking through threads about fury warriors pre and post Titan's Grip, I have seen several times that a slower offhand is much better. I am sure there is a very obvious and well known answer for this, but why?

Thanks =)

#12 Ginormus

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Posted 14 November 2008 - 11:24 PM

Just a thought, since Blizzard moved crushing blows to +4 levels instead of +3 levels, should we assume that all "??" mobs will be +4 levels above us @ level 80? If so wouldn't we want the numbers for 80 vs 84 mob instead of 83?

#13 JamesVZ

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 12:48 AM

They did that specifically so bosses wouldn't crush anymore, so I'd still assume +3 levels on boss level mobs.
They got that 40 man...40 man, ooh, ooh, ooh. And all I wanna do is raid it.

#14 Ja7us

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 01:06 AM

How does Slam interact with the autoswing timer? I've heard that it 1) resets it completely, 2) that it postpones your swing until the Slam cast ends, and that 3) you can swing while in the middle of a Slam cast (i.e. that your swing is not at all affected by using Slam).

If 2) is correct, does using Slam while your autoswing is recharging delay it further?

That is, which of these scenarios (if either) is correct, using a 4.0 speed weapon:

0.0 Begin swing
2.0 Begin Slam
2.5 End Slam
4.0 Swing

or:

0.0 Begin swing
2.0 Begin Slam
2.5 End Slam
4.5 Swing

#15 Glimred

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 01:38 AM

Your second scenario is correct, Slam suspends your autoswing but does not reset it.

#16 Telperion

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 01:50 AM

I'm still a bit shaky on the mitigation end of the lvl 80 prot warrior. First big question is about crushing is it still in the game and is there anyway to wipe it from the table now that shield block has been changed. Also what is the cap on armor for dmg reduction. Thanks for any help offered.

#17 bcswen

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 07:13 AM

Crushes are still in the game, but the only mobs that can crush are those that are at least 4 levels above you. Hence, crushes won't occur in a raid setting.

#18 Kilj

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 11:19 AM

Thanks for posting the hit/expertise caps, Steve! I was wondering about what the level 80 values would be...

I haven't yet seen the breakdown of SEP at 80 with an 18/53/0 build... With the changes to armor pen and what not, I'm not sure if once I cap out hit and exp if I should attempt to stack crit, haste, or arp.

If anyone has quick access to a list of stats to prioritize for level 80 raiding and to what degree, I would really appreciate it!

EDIT: Remembered the name of what I was looking for.

#19 Vismor

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 05:53 PM

Hello everyone!

I've got some questions about my warrior. I hope you can give me an answer:

First:
I know that Agility gives a raise to critics percentage, and Cruelty (is this the name of one of the first talents of fury? I play in spanish, so I don't know the talent's name in english) gives a +5% to critics too when attacking with melee weapons, but I've noticed that when I look my stats, the critics percentage it's a little bit lower than the sum of my crit given by agility and the crit given by Cruelty (of course, I've got a melee weapon equipped), so I wonder if there are another stat or circumstance that I'm missing on the math. I haven't any equipment (in fact I tried without any piece of armor, shield, trinket, etc... equipped, only the main hand weapon), buff, debuff or talent that affects crit.

Maybe the +5% of Cruelty is not so exact?

For example, I've got an 8'88% of crit given by agi and the 5% of Cruelty and the crit percentage shown in melee stats is about 13'70%, not 13'88. Is there a reason for that?

Second:

Is there too much difference between leveling in arms and leveling in fury? What spec is better for leveling?

#20 Prinsesa

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Posted 15 November 2008 - 06:22 PM

Saizul: Slow off-hands are preferred to maximize the damage dealt by Whirlwind. It used to be that a fast off-hand was preferred because Deep Wounds would always base its damage on the main-hand, even if it was an off-hand auto-attack crit that procced it, but since that was changed, the prevailing trend went back to slow OHs.

Ginormus: Yes, crushing blows were changed to only happen against mobs 4 levels higher than the player. No, boss mobs are not level 84, they are still level 83, hence making crushing blows a mechanic that exists only if you try to attack mobs that outlevel you significantly.

Crushing blows will not a part of the level 80 raiding/instancing game, at all.

Vismor: Simply put, base crit is not 0%. That is, if you had no AGI at all, your crit chance would be in the negative.
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