Jump to content


Photo

Feral questions?


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
857 replies to this topic

#41 mmartinx

mmartinx

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 481 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 02:22 PM

Dominos/Bartender will allow you to page action bars based on friendly/enemy targets, so you can have it switch to displaying your healing spells when you have a friendly target selected. I also have it switch to my healing bar when I hold down my self-cast modifier.


This.

I actually used to use this with Flexbar way back in 2005? on my priest. That should work perfectly, thanks for the suggestion.

#42 mmartinx

mmartinx

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 481 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 02:25 PM

Oh boy, keybinds! I guess it is a new expansion, though.

You can also use ~, q, e, f, z, x, c and v easily. Throw on shift modifiers for most of those and you'll have plenty of binds. You'll also want to have innervate and barkskin somewhere convenient.


I use all those but they're occupied :(

Err, my question was more of a hotbar issue than anything, I definitely didn't want to devolve this into hay guyz heres my keybinds.

#43 HaklePrime

HaklePrime

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 376 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 04:35 PM

Just wondering what peoples thoughts are of the current ferocious bite, I had 4pT6 and cat spec at the time of testing this and was getting 12-15k FB crits. These weren't one offs and pretty much everyone was well over 10k (5 cp)

I assume this is not intended as 15k just seems too much. I had approx 8k+ AP with SR (5 man party, warrior, pala, pala % priest)


For added fun, bribe your rogues for Tricks of the Trade! 18k+ FBs are fun as hell :D

#44 Criteris

Criteris

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 4 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 04:58 PM

I've been looking through the available enchants, but i haven't seen a new +35 agility enchant for Wrath, or a similar enchant for tanking that i can tell. Is mongoose still the enchant to get on your weapon?

#45 Caniki

Caniki

    Crayon in Brain

  • Allied Members
  • 4,499 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 05:23 PM

I've been looking through the available enchants, but i haven't seen a new +35 agility enchant for Wrath, or a similar enchant for tanking that i can tell. Is mongoose still the enchant to get on your weapon?


Sadly, yes.

#46 Artemas

Artemas

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 21 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 06:58 PM

1) I still see some druids using 2t4 at level 80. Isn't the proc rate of the bonus at lvl 80 0% now? Can anyone confirm that the bonus does NOT work anymore at max level?

2) Besides +35 agil and Mongoose, are there better enchants avaliable at the moment for tanking? How about cat DPS?

3) I was in SW/t6 gear. I hit 80 2 days ago, and my dodge in bear is only around 35% raid buffed. Should I stack Stam > Agility, then move towards Agil > Stam after I have plenty of stam (just like early vs. late TBC raiding)?

4) I apologize if I missed this, but has anyone made a good, comprehensive "must-get" list of epic-only iLvl 200+ from heroics/raid for tanking and cat druid?

Thanks ahead of time!

#47 Enoon

Enoon

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 9 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 07:14 PM

1)2) Besides +35 agil and Mongoose, are there better enchants avaliable at the moment for tanking? How about cat DPS?


I am trying 85 AP on my staff due to Predatory Strikes and Savage Roar, not to mention it is every cheap as I will be getting new weapons rather frequently at first I imagine.

#48 Malazaar

Malazaar

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 336 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 09:07 PM

One that topic, does anyone know for sure if an AP-Weaponenchant like Savagery benefits from Predatory Strikes ?

#49 Celeras

Celeras

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 54 posts

Posted 20 November 2008 - 10:23 PM

1)Before the Cat megathread was closed Rannasha mentioned STR had become our most powerful DPS attribute and RAWR seems to support this (at least in gemming) but i was curious how many others are adding strength gems vs +hit,+exp,+crit, or agility gems. I guess I'm mostly concerned with what crit level I should be aiming vs AP or is this an old school mentality and we are no longer caring as much about crit%?


I don't understand Rannasha's thread at all. It very bluntly states that Str is the best DPS stat, followed by AP, followed by Agility. Then, he goes on to chose all agility enchants? 20 agility to gloves, over 44AP? 16 agility to boots, over 32 AP?

I just don't get where he came up with these choices. It seems completely contradictory, but there may just be something I'm not understanding.

#50 Taudark

Taudark

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 36 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 10:36 AM

It's not that we don't care about crit, it's that we'll always be at the point where more crit is good, but more strength is better. So given the choice between comparable levels of crit and STR, go for STR. Now, hit and exp are a different matter. First off, their values change depending on how much of them you have (Rawr is your friend here). But the more difficult part is that missing blows can interrupt your damage cycle, which results in greater loss of dps then the missed strikes themselves. This part is very difficult to model, and different people respond differently to dynamic cycles. I don't believe a consensus on this has been reached yet, but I'm personally planning to prioritize hit and exp within reason.



Isn't it the same with crit? (Like hit and expertise) But instead of losing DPS from "missing" You gain a lot by critting. Basically, if you don't crit, you lose dps by only getting 1 combo point. Because when I have low crit, I often don't have get enough energy to keep my rotation up.



3)Is it still okay to RIP at 4cp or do i need to wait until 5cp in the new rotations? Also, I haven't seen it stated anywhere yet but I'm guessing that we want to do a 5cp Savage Roar first and then build up 5cp for a RIP or should it be reversed?


I'd say 2-3 Savage Roar 5 RIP. All you should think about really... is that rake & savage roar should be up at all times, rip as often as possible and mangle (unless you have a MS warrior in raid) should also be on all the time.


6) What percent is needed to be crit immune from lvl 80 bosses and does SotF reach that limit on its own?
I was looking around but read conflicting reports about it leaving a slight margin on end-game bosses.


5.6%

#51 Taudark

Taudark

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 36 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 10:42 AM

1) I still see some druids using 2t4 at level 80. Isn't the proc rate of the bonus at lvl 80 0% now? Can anyone confirm that the bonus does NOT work anymore at max level?

2) Besides +35 agil and Mongoose, are there better enchants avaliable at the moment for tanking? How about cat DPS?

3) I was in SW/t6 gear. I hit 80 2 days ago, and my dodge in bear is only around 35% raid buffed. Should I stack Stam > Agility, then move towards Agil > Stam after I have plenty of stam (just like early vs. late TBC raiding)?

4) I apologize if I missed this, but has anyone made a good, comprehensive "must-get" list of epic-only iLvl 200+ from heroics/raid for tanking and cat druid?

Thanks ahead of time!


1) It hasn't procced once for me at level 80. (12 hours played)
3) Not sure, but honestly I believe you will have enough stamina from just gear. With 2 lvl 80 blue items (& t6 quality items)I have 26000 health unbuffed.

#52 Stigmata

Stigmata

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 318 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 11:00 AM

3) I was in SW/t6 gear. I hit 80 2 days ago, and my dodge in bear is only around 35% raid buffed. Should I stack Stam > Agility, then move towards Agil > Stam after I have plenty of stam (just like early vs. late TBC raiding)?


I have similar concerns, my dodge last night was only at 31% in a 5 man group, I had about 35k HP though. I've not enchanted my gear with the best enchants yet, as I am constantly replacing it and trying to find a good balance.

My biggest concern is lack of dodge, as it is our only avoidance stat and witht he upcoming armor change I feel that HP has a lesser value with my current stats.

I intend to go for around 35-40k HP with 40+% dodge in the short term, I think this should be possible having had a quick glace at the available gear.

#53 Abradix

Abradix

    Bald Bull

  • Members
  • 1,214 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 11:19 AM

If you're talking 25man raiding, you're pretty much set once you reach 40k health buffed, which is fairly easy since buffs amount to about 10k health. The reason for this is that most breaths (Well, Malygos and Sarth with dragon(s) up) hit for around 25k, you want to survive that plus a possible hit + Parry hit, so around 40k health. You can argue that there's less chance of that happening if you stack dodge, but really, you're not going to avoid two hits in a row.

After that it's pretty much armor and dodge, and of course the armor part of that is falling away.

#54 Shrea

Shrea

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 40 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 11:30 AM

Okay so after the tireless grind to level 80 my guild has decided to run 25 man Naxx. I went in after just hitting 80, hadnt even trained my level 80 skills yet. I pulled 11 on the dps meters. This greatly disappooints me, but it does want to make me work harder. Currently I am in BT/Sunwell epics, with a few pieces that I picked up out of the Naxx tonight.

One of the things I was very unclear of is what the dps rotation is. From what Ive read here SR is something that should remain up at all times. And I did my best to keep it up. Weather it be a 4CP SR or a 1CP SR. Basicallly on the bosses what I was doing was:

mangle+SR+Shrea to 5CP+FB+Shrea tp 3CP+SR+Shread to 5CP+FB

Now on Thaddius I was getting 20K+ FB's. I was going off the word of another druid how had gotten number 2 on the dps meters the night before in Naxx 10. Another one of my questions is should I really be using FB as much as I am or should I still be using rip. With SR up does Rip out shine FB?

Like I stated earlier I been reading though these pages. Not that many but I took the time to try and read through most of them hoping I would catch an answer to some of my questions. And although some of the post here are very interesting, none really answered the question I was looking for. But if its here I do apologize for asking twice. I recently downloaded the undated version of RAWR, and to my surprise alot of the gem choices where upgraded to Strength instead of Agil. After reading a few post I found that because strength increase your AP it makes it over powered when using SR. However what I am curious about is, ferals have a talent that gives an extra combo point ber crit, wouldn't it be wise to stack agility gems for the added crit? Or are we going for the massive hits?

I was a kind of unclear on the the Tsokk's(sp?) calculation wiki. (Ive never been the one for numbers) But from what I can gather haste is still very bad for driuds (kitty druids that is.) Strength now outweighs agilty, and its alot easier to become hit capped. What I dont understand is what exactly are we going for? Are for going for the massive special attacks? Or are we going for the massive bleed damage attacks?

So to summarize for those that hate reading, here are the questions I was hoping to get answered. And if possible any advice would be welcome. Please don't spare my feelings because as it stands now I feel like a bad player. And that is the last thing in the world I would like. So here are the questions:

1) What is the DPS rotation for a feral kitty in my gear?
2) Another one of my questions is should I really be using FB as much as I am or should I still be using rip. With SR up does Rip out shine FB?
3) Wouldn't it be wise to stack agility gems for the added crit? Or are we going for the massive hits?
4) Are for going for the massive special attacks? Or are we going for the massive bleed damage attacks?

(On a side note this is mainly about cat specs. Tanking Im fine. I kick butt like I believe every feral druid does. Im just curious about the dps side of things)

#55 david0925

david0925

    Don Flamenco

  • Members
  • 498 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:00 PM

There is NO rotation involved with cat DPS, priority is as follows
1.Keep Savage Roar up
2.Keep Mangle Up
3.Keep Rake up
4.Keep rip up

Otherwise just shred.

2.With the glyph of Rip, rip does more damage per energy than FB even with FB at 100% crite rate. However, FB can be used if you generate combo points too quickly via Primal Fury.
3.Expertise> Hit > Strength > Agility, I am not sure about haste and armor pen
4.Bleed IS special damage, and yes, feral druid's damage is still going to be a lot of yellow.

#56 Shrea

Shrea

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 40 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 12:21 PM

edit...nevermind question was answered.

#57 Mysticum

Mysticum

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 36 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:20 PM

As previously stated, forgetting both Rake and Rip is going to hurt your dps a lot, even more so when you get the 2-piece bonus from T7.


From one thing to another, does anyone have a working shapeshifting macro? I always use shapeshifting macros, like the following:

#showtooltip
#show Cat Form
/cancelform [stance:5]
/cast !Cat Form

This allows me to reshapeshift on the same button, which really is more of a PvP habit. However, I want to switch weapons with stance dancing. Armor/dodge weapon for bear form, dps weapon for cat, and for caster form (also have a macro for caster form) a spell power weapon for off-heal situations.

The macro I used to have is:

#showtooltip
#show Cat Form
/cancelform [stance:5]
/cast !Cat Form
/equip [nostance] Staff of Trickery

This has always been working for me, but not anymore. It sure does shapeshift into cat with the equiped weapon, but my feral AP isn't right. Instead of 6065 AP which is the correct value, it shows 5659, which is much lower. Reshapeshifting one more time shows the right AP again. Quite a huge benefit as you can see. Why is that?

The problem seems to be that I change weapon after shapeshifting, which really is the key to the problem, since I can't switch weapon before shapeshifting if I want it during the same GCD while in combat. My guess is that it's a bug, since switching weapon during cat form doesn't show the correct AP at any time.

#58 Cluey

Cluey

    King Hippo

  • Members
  • 622 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:40 PM

mangle+SR+Shrea to 5CP+FB+Shrea tp 3CP+SR+Shread to 5CP+FB

You need to read more, both the information here and tooltips too, Shred. Shred damage isn't increased by Mangle anymore but by bleeds.
Edit. As was pointed out below I should have linked the Mangle tooltip as it no longer mentions Shred on it.
In a 25 man raid chances are there was a bleed up but if there wasn't you were missing out on bonus Shred damage.
You need to know if there is an Arms warrior in the raid with Trauma, if there is you shouldn't need to worry about Mangle otherwise you need to keep it up.
Given that around 60% of a cats damage comes from attacks using Energy missing a point in Ferocity seems a pretty bad choice to me.

Many of the questions you and others have asked recently have already been answered.
Every time someone can't be bothered searching and just asks the answered questions, because it is easier for them, it makes the threads longer leading to more people not looking for the answers.
The problem becomes worse every time this happens.

So could everyone asking dumb questions please put some effort in to finding their answers and not perpetuating the problem?

The problem seems to be that I change weapon after shapeshifting, which really is the key to the problem, since I can't switch weapon before shapeshifting if I want it during the same GCD while in combat. My guess is that it's a bug, since switching weapon during cat form doesn't show the correct AP at any time.

This has been a bug in the past so I am guessing it has come back again.

As for weapon switching I have been using a mod to do that for a long time, so long I feel lost without it.
StanceSets V3.1 Fan Update - Addons - Curse
Having linked that up I am using a slightly older version as the latest doesn't quite do what I am used to.

In the normal key bindings menu there will be bindings for this, I have a button set to "equip next set" and then setup the weapons and idols for the set I want in that form.
There is a tick box called "Equip first on activate", if you have that checked when you shift to that form it will equip that set.
Default is caster form, I don't have it set for that otherwise you will always end up in a GCD when you shift out in combat.

There are more bindings available but I haven't found the need for them, the original version of the mod I got used to didn't have them.
With this setup the same button will always equip the weapons you have configured for that form, you can set up to three different weapon sets per form/stance and it will rotate through them. I currently only have one for each but I did use multiple sets for things like tanking Brutallus and Twins, one would be a threat weapon and the other an AC one, just press the next set binding and it will swap between them.

The aspect of this I like is that it is always the same button, you don't have to think "which button equips the weapon I want for cat/bear/healer?"
I just looked and I am using Version 2.2 which is a few versions out of date, I did try 3.0.2 but something has changed and it doesn't do what I expect it to, the comments indicate others have noticed this too.

For shapeshifting I use Druid Bar - Addons - Curse
I could write macro's to do what Easy Shifting does but this saves macro space, it will also show you your mana in forms if you don't have a unit frame which does this already.
Having said that I don't use macro's to change form like you describe, if I want to go from cat to cat I press my button twice. There is the option of modifying the macro the mod is using though so you might be able to take advantage of the other features offered.
There is a fancy binding to chose the best form for moving quickly based of your current circumstances.
If you are in combat it will put you in Travel Form.
Not in combat and in the old world? The mount you specify.
Not in combat but moving in the old world? Travel form again.
In Outland or Northrend*? Flight Form.

* Until you have got to level 77 and trained cold weather flying it currently gets confused.

#59 Dibsclaw

Dibsclaw

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 10 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:44 PM

You need to read more, both the information here and tooltips too, Shred. Shred damage isn't increased by Mangle anymore but by bleeds.


I think you may need to re-read those tooltips yourself:
"Effects which increase Bleed damage also increase Shred damage."
E.g. Mangle and Trauma.

Edit: You may be mixing it up with Rend & Tear, which inscreses the damage of Maul and Shred on bleeding targets, and the crit chance of FB on bleeding targets.

#60 Wednesday

Wednesday

    I'm a fool about my…

  • Members
  • 580 posts

Posted 21 November 2008 - 02:50 PM

#showtooltip
#show Cat Form
/cancelform [stance:5]
/cast !Cat Form
/equip [nostance] Staff of Trickery


Maybe I'm missing something, but why do you have shapeshifting on the same macro you use to switch weapons?




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users