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Feral Druid Numbers (updated for 3.2.2)


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#1 RareBeast

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 01:10 AM

I've been repeatedly coming back to threads here & on Wowwiki looking for these and figured it would be useful to more than just myself to have them consolidated in one post.

All of these are for Level 80 Feral with HotW, SotF & Imp.MotW talents. Numbers in (brackets) are with Blessing of Kings :-


Strength
1 Str = 2.37864 AP (2.616504 AP) (Cat)
1 Str = 2.1624 AP (2.37864 AP) (Bear)
1 Str = 2.292144 AP (2.5213584 AP) (Bear with PotP)


Agility

1 Agi = 1.18932 AP (1.308252 AP) (Cat only)
1 Agi = 0.0129744% (0.01427184%) Crit
1 Agi = 0.0225641% (0.0248206%) Dodge
1 Agi = 2.1624 (2.37864) Armor

77.075 (70.068) Agi = 1% Crit
44.318 (40.289)Agi = 1% Dodge


Stamina
1 Sta = 10.812 (11.8932) Health (Cat)
1 Sta = 14.8665 (16.35315) Health (Bear)


Intellect
1 Int = 19.4616 (21.40776) Mana
1 Int = 0.00778464% (0.0085631%) SpellCrit

125.458 (116.780) Int = 1% SpellCrit

Intellect also increases the amount of health & mana regen you get from Spirit - not very important for ferals


Spirit
Spirit increases your out of combat health regen and your out of 5sec rule mana regen - not very important for ferals


Crit Rating
1 CritRating = 0.022% Crit
45.91 CritRating = 1% Crit


Dodge Rating
1 DodgeRating = 0.0220982% Dodge
45.2525 DodgeRating = 1% Dodge


Haste Rating
1 HasteRating = 0.03965% Haste
25.223 HasteRating = 1% Haste


Hit Rating
1 HitRating = 0.030% Hit
32.79 HitRating = 1% Hit

Cap vs Level 80 mob = 5% Hit = 163.95 HitRating
Cap vs Level 81 mob = 5.5% Hit = 180.34 HitRating
Cap vs Level 82 mob = 6% Hit = 196.74 HitRating
Cap vs Level 83 mob = 8% Hit = 262.32 HitRating (Raid Bosses)


Expertise Rating
1 ExpertiseRating = 0.0305% reduction in dodge & parry chance
32.79 ExpertiseRating = 1% reduction in dodge & parry chance

Cap vs Level 80 mob = 5%(Dodge) / ?%(Parry) = 163.95 / ? ExpertiseRating
Cap vs Level 81 mob = 5.5%(Dodge) / ?%(Parry) = 180.345 / ? ExpertiseRating
Cap vs Level 82 mob = 6%(Dodge) / ?%(Parry) = 196.74 / ? ExpertiseRating
Cap vs Level 83 mob = 6.5%(Dodge) / 15%(Parry) = 213.135 / 491.85 ExpertiseRating (Raid Bosses)

The 10 Expertise we get from Primal Precision is equivalent to 81.975 ExpertiseRating so subtract that from the above figures if you have that talent.


Defense Rating
1 DefenseRating = 0.008% dodge and 0.008% chance to be missed and 0.008% reduced chance to be crit (Crit reduction not needed for PvE if you have SotF )
122.96 Defense Rating = 1% chance to dodge and 1% chance to be missed and 1% reduced chance to be crit (Crit reduction not needed for PvE if you have SotF )

1 DefRating = 0.64 DodgeRating (counting misses as dodges)


ArmorPenetration Rating
1 ArPenRating = 0.07145% ArmorPenetration
13.9957272 ArPenRating = 1% Armor Penetration

ArPen cap (100%) = 1400 ArPen


Resilience
94.27125 Resilience = -1% chance to be crit, -2.2% crit damage, -1% all damage & -2.2% mana drain reduction

1414.06872 Resilience = 33% reduction from crit damage = the cap for this part of resilience's effect


Regualar (white) Armor
Includes non-bonus armor from all slots except rings, trinkets, neck & weapon. All armor from rings, trinkets, neck & weapon as well as armor patchs & any bonus (green) armor on items & armor from Agi receive no bonus from SotF, Thick Hide or the metagem

1 Armor = 6.251 Armor (Bear)
1 Armor = 6.8761 Armor (Bear with Thick Hide)
1 Armor = 7.013622 Armor (Bear with Thick Hide & Armor Metagem)

Damage Reduction from Armor % = Armor * 100 / (Armor + (467.5 * AttackerLevel - 22167.5))

DR% for Lvl83 Boss mobs = Armor * 100 / (Armor + 16635)

Armor cap (75% DR) for Lvl83 Boss mobs = 49905 Armor





Any feedback, suggestions and/or corrections are welcome and will be incorporated into this post

#2 Rainman5419

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 01:33 AM

Good to find a consolidated place for all the stats, but all of the stat breakdowns are in the currently locked Cat or Bear threads in the forums. Then again the druid subforum seems a bit of a mess atm, so I'm not sure how exactly the mods want all the information split/consolidated.

#3 Tulathros

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 03:00 AM

(I have ignored the 6% to all stats from SotF for simplicity)


Simplicity has its place, a thread with exact numbers is not the place for simplicity, i would highly recommend including the extra 6% from SotF. I would also consider adding in a "with kings" option, for example:

x stat = y stat (stat with kings)

Strength
1 Str = 2.32(2.5) AP (Cat)
1 Str = 2.0(2.2) AP (Bear)

Also you have a typo in your defense section, should be 0.008% not 1%

1 DefenseRating = 0.008% dodge and 1% chance to be missed (and 1% reduced chance to be crit if you don't have SotF)



#4 RareBeast

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 07:58 AM

Thanks for that, typo is fixed.


I wasn't sure whether or not to include SotF. For Strength it is simple. But when you start getting into things like how much dodge and crit you get from Agi, and how many Agi = 1% dodge & crit then it gets a bit more complicated. As soon as I get a chance, i'll go through and include the SotF & Kings figures. Every feral should have SotF so i'll use that as the base and then add a BoK figure in a different colour.

Thanks for the feedback.

#5 Ja7us

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 10:19 AM

Cap vs Level 83 mob = 6.5%(Dodge) / 15%(Parry) = 213.13 / 191.85 ExpertiseRating (Raid Bosses)


This isn't right. The cap for 15% parry should be somewhere in the neighborhood of 500 expertise rating, not 191.

#6 charriu

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 12:21 PM

This isn't right. The cap for 15% parry should be somewhere in the neighborhood of 500 expertise rating, not 191.


http://elitistjerks....ngs_level_80_a/

15% -parry = 15 * 32.79 = 491.85 expertise rating to negate 15% parry.

#7 Abradix

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 01:08 PM

The 10 Expertise we get from Primal Precision is equivalent to 32.9 ExpertiseRating so subtract that from the above figures if you have that talent.


This is incorrect. 32.79 ExpertiseRating gives 4 Expertise. Every point of expertise reduces the chance to be parried/dodged by 0.25%. Primal Precision increases your Expertise by 10, which reduces your chance to be dodged/parried by 2.5%, and is equal to 81.975 Expertise rating. For simplicities sake, you can also just state every point of expertise costs 8.2 ExpertiseRating.

#8 RareBeast

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 03:16 PM

http://elitistjerks....ngs_level_80_a/

15% -parry = 15 * 32.79 = 491.85 expertise rating to negate 15% parry.


Thanks Charriu, yet another typo fixed :( I checked it all so carefully I thought.



This is incorrect. 32.79 ExpertiseRating gives 4 Expertise. Every point of expertise reduces the chance to be parried/dodged by 0.25%. Primal Precision increases your Expertise by 10, which reduces your chance to be dodged/parried by 2.5%, and is equal to 81.975 Expertise rating. For simplicities sake, you can also just state every point of expertise costs 8.2 ExpertiseRating.



Thanks for that Abradix. I re-read the Wowiki pages along with your info and I see where I was misunderstanding the expertise to expertise rating ratio. Fixed in the original post now.

#9 Abranor

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 07:51 PM

I'm curious about the expertise cap against boss level mobs. In this thread I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 213.13. However under the Class Mechanics forum thread FAQ Working theories of raiding at level 80 I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 189.

Am I missing something?

#10 kalbear

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 08:25 PM

I'm curious about the expertise cap against boss level mobs. In this thread I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 213.13. However under the Class Mechanics forum thread FAQ Working theories of raiding at level 80 I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 189.

It depends on what assumption of dodge rates you have for a mob is. And that's a bit debatable. It ranges from 6.25% (what was listed there) to 7% (here) and 7.5% (elsewhere). Same goes for parry. It's really not known; each boss has different values for both dodge and parry.

To be clear, there is no expertise 'cap' in the sense that more will not be counted at all. There is no hard number for this. There are simply targets.

#11 Mijae

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 08:28 PM

I'm curious about the expertise cap against boss level mobs. In this thread I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 213.13. However under the Class Mechanics forum thread FAQ Working theories of raiding at level 80 I'm reading that the Expertise cap (for no dodged attacks) is 189.

Am I missing something?


They are probably still using the cap as 5.6% rather than 6.5%. There was some discussion on this a while back and while I don't remember where to find the definite conclusive results, the consensus was 6.5%.

The parry cap is also in question. I remember reading it was actually slightly below 15%.

#12 Abranor

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Posted 19 November 2008 - 09:08 PM

Thank you for your replies, I'll err on the side of caution and go with 6.5% as the cap untill there is proof otherwise. It gives me a place to steer the ferals in my guild towards when looking for the actual "cap" numbers.

#13 RareBeast

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 12:26 AM

Yes, the 15% parry is certainly not confirmed from what I can find. There is even less information on non-boss mobs parry rates. The 6.5% dodge rate for bosses is one that I have seen fairly consistantly in several places so I think it is likely to be accurate.

If someone wants to respec out of Primal Precision, take off all their Expertise gear and test it on one of the target dummies, I would love to see the results. I can't do it yet as I am only 77 still and the tests should really be done at 80.

#14 hyphae

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 05:47 AM

I am new at the whole feral aspect of the druid. i do how ever have one question. When getting gear for stats what do i look for the most and what do i look for the least? Meaning with a mage you would look for Hit > Haste > Spell Damage > Spell Crit. and with that you would want to get 164 hit (max) then once you get 164 hit you move to the next one which would be haste which say you wanted 300 haste and then you move to spell damage.

What if at all is it for a feral druid in bear form and cat form.

Thank you for any advice given.

#15 Abradix

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 07:37 AM

Try asking in the Feral questions thread, this is not the place for such a question.

#16 spartakos

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 10:51 AM

About the new FAP posts.
Don't you think that talents/skills like Predatory Strikes, Savage Roar will take a big hit from this change. Especially Predatory Strikes becomes wasted,but unfortunately necessary, talent points once more.

#17 Daboran

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 11:26 AM

If you could amend the numbers as suggested earlier, to include Sotf and brakcet for Kings etc, this might make a good sticky thread. We could then have seperate threads for other Druid faq's instead of having one multipage sticky.

#18 hyphae

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 01:30 PM

Try asking in the Feral questions thread, this is not the place for such a question.


How is this not a place for such a question? Doesn't the title say "Feral Druid Numbers"? Last time I checked it did and that was what I was asking for. I could see this being the wrong place if I was asking something about a talent but I'm not. Please think before you post because that was very rude the way you put it.

Thank You.

#19 Malazaar

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 03:36 PM

About the new FAP posts.
Don't you think that talents/skills like Predatory Strikes, Savage Roar will take a big hit from this change. Especially Predatory Strikes becomes wasted,but unfortunately necessary, talent points once more.


They way i understood the blue post, we will still gain FAP - just that i won't state so on the weapon. Instead a 155 dps weapon will automatically convert to (154 - ~55) * 14 = 1400 AP for us. So Predatory Instincts and Savage Roar shouldn't be affected.

If i misunderstood it though and we will no longer get AP from weapons, we WILL suffer a significant DPS loss from the change. Not only due to savage roar but also many of our abilities only scale with AP, not with weapon damage (like rip, rake, bite).

#20 coldbear

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Posted 20 November 2008 - 06:21 PM

I am new at the whole feral aspect of the druid. i do how ever have one question. When getting gear for stats what do i look for the most and what do i look for the least? Meaning with a mage you would look for Hit > Haste > Spell Damage > Spell Crit. and with that you would want to get 164 hit (max) then once you get 164 hit you move to the next one which would be haste which say you wanted 300 haste and then you move to spell damage.


Look in the (currently locked) Feral Cat and Feral Bear Megathreads.

Long story short, Bear: Sta or Sta/Agi with as much Armour as you can manage excepting on cloaks/necks/rings where it (in a few days) no longer matters, Expertise (very important) Dodge, Defense and maybe some Hit too.

Cat: Hit to 295 iirc dep on talents, Exp and Str way over Agi, which is a bit of a change from TBC when it was ALL about the Agi.

As is, the 80 endgame can be cleared in quest greens, so the entire focus of these forums is kind of in limbo right now, 25 puggers who've done Karazhan a few times can easily farm the best PVE gear in the game right now. And nevermind the natives here, they can be a little abrasive. It is, after all, the Elitist JERKS forum. You may also want to read all the stickies in various forums, and try a little more searching next time.

Edit: Nvm Abradix, the guy obviously didn't even bother looking at the rest of the threads in this forum or even googling anything. My mistake. Here, I just did his work for him:
http://elitistjerks....cat_megathread/
http://elitistjerks....ear_megathread/




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