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#21 uliko

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 12:48 PM

There are very few reasons to socket sp/spi as pure reds gives more spellpower obviously and sp/int gives more mana. As for meta I'm using sp/speed one since it allows me to enchant 18 spirit on boots. The mana restore meta was pretty good at 70 even though I never used it but with a new spammable 1.5s spell it should proc alot more.

The staffs are very similiar so just take whatever drops first. Or if you really dont like crit or haste wait for the other but since you asked I doubt you have any preference.

The weakest t7 part is the helm since both crit and haste are superior to mp5. So my number one choice is but it will probably be highly sought after by everyone so I think I have to settle with instead and if that fails aswell it will be the legs you mentioned .

#22 Fallenangel

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 02:53 PM

The reason for socketing SP/spi is the same as SP/int - to match socket bonuses. They are usually quite strong and worh aiming for - otherwise pure SP is the way to go as it's our best scaling stat by far.
I'm at 1/5 T7 at the moment and I can't say the set bonuses look very attractive. 4t7 is only effective when used on a tank, but I don't see it beating a glyphed regrowth. Nourish isn't Flash of Light, it can't be spammed because of its high mana cost. Cancel-casting is better done with our bigger heals - regrowth and HT.

#23 Unseen

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 04:32 PM

I find the 2pc t7 bonus to be quite strong. At least in 10-man content, rejuvenation is often the spell i heal the most with on boss encounters where raid healing is needed (Malygos is a good example). I will try to pick up the rejuvenation idol to use on such encounters as well, while i'll probably keep using the Lifebloom idol on encounters where i mostly heal tanks.

Edit: Speaking of gems, has anyone found out where the recipe for drops? Haven't found any site that lists it yet.

#24 uliko

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 05:27 PM

Recipe doesnt exist, same with alot of other good gems incl. str/crit, agi/sta and sp/spi as you noted.

#25 Guest_Altamont_*

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 07:30 PM

For your weapon slot, it seems like MH/OH combo still beats a staff big time.


that's the way it's looking. currently i have and . seems it is better than any of those staffs.

i wouldnt mind getting my hands on for my oh if i go mh/oh. and i think the only upgrade i could get form my mace now is but i'm sure i won't see that for a little bit.

#26 sulliwan

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 08:03 PM

4t7 is only effective when used on a tank, but I don't see it beating a glyphed regrowth. Nourish isn't Flash of Light, it can't be spammed because of its high mana cost. Cancel-casting is better done with our bigger heals - regrowth and HT.


What? Nourish costs LESS mana than Flash of Light and heals for more.

#27 Playered

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 09:59 PM

What? Nourish costs LESS mana than Flash of Light and heals for more.


What are you on about, Paladin FoL is around 300 mana or so and Nourish is about 600 with talents.
You are thinking of Flash Heal (Priests)?

Ignoring Living Seed I'm also not convinced on the 4T7 making Nourish better than Glyphed RG - however this is assuming RG will always crit and in raiding you have about 65-70% at best of that.
For me (4T7 assuming +35% not +20%*15%)Nourish comes out around 4000 HPS while Glyphed RG which crits nearly all the time is coming out at around 6000 HPS - and Nourish comes out around 8HPM and RG 11HPM.

I wouldn't trust that basic late night math much but until I see some solid figures comparing both I remain unconvinced that Nourish is much cop even with 4T7.

#28 Guest_Altamont_*

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Posted 30 November 2008 - 11:52 PM

There are very few reasons to socket sp/spi as pure reds gives more spellpower obviously and sp/int gives more mana. As for meta I'm using sp/speed one since it allows me to enchant 18 spirit on boots. The mana restore meta was pretty good at 70 even though I never used it but with a new spammable 1.5s spell it should proc alot more.

The staffs are very similiar so just take whatever drops first. Or if you really dont like crit or haste wait for the other but since you asked I doubt you have any preference.

The weakest t7 part is the helm since both crit and haste are superior to mp5. So my number one choice is but it will probably be highly sought after by everyone so I think I have to settle with instead and if that fails aswell it will be the legs you mentioned .


t7.5 vs boneyard legs

you think the haste is > spirit and crit?

#29 uliko

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:23 AM

Guess I could go for instead of the legs but thats taking cloth again. But yeah I value haste over spirit and crit since spirit isn't needed since all mana comes from intellect anyway pretty much thanks to innervate and replenishment. Crit is just so meh for druids. Sure many druids are running around screaming regrowth is sooooo good it crits ALL the time bla bla. I just dont think its good to rely on it critting. Healing is all about worst case scenario and not average like DPS and in the worst case scenario regrowth isn't critting. Reliable healing (haste) beats big numbers (crit).

#30 Nitz

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:40 AM

I can't figure how you might think crit is superior to mp5. It might be me, but I always value reliability higher than hps procs (crit, or haste trinkets, things like that). I also very rarely stand still and chain cast Regrowth or Nourish with Swiftmends in between to make crit worthwile. But what I do have are mana problems and the ability to dish out more spells without finding myself running out of mana when things go wrong via regen stats is preferable to have 3 spells I won't even spam critting 3 or 4% more.

#31 uliko

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:51 AM

It's not the crit on the Hood but the raw spellpower on it, it's 21 higher then everything else.

#32 ithecho84

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 06:11 AM

Would anyone be able to do the math on how much haste you need to get a 1 second cooldown with the different ranks of Gift of the Earthmother?
The math is just way beyond me. Please help this simpleton out :(

#33 sulliwan

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 08:56 AM

What are you on about, Paladin FoL is around 300 mana or so and Nourish is about 600 with talents.
You are thinking of Flash Heal (Priests)?

Ignoring Living Seed I'm also not convinced on the 4T7 making Nourish better than Glyphed RG - however this is assuming RG will always crit and in raiding you have about 65-70% at best of that.
For me (4T7 assuming +35% not +20%*15%)Nourish comes out around 4000 HPS while Glyphed RG which crits nearly all the time is coming out at around 6000 HPS - and Nourish comes out around 8HPM and RG 11HPM.

I wouldn't trust that basic late night math much but until I see some solid figures comparing both I remain unconvinced that Nourish is much cop even with 4T7.


Oops, It was late and I mixed up the spell names, of course I meant Flash Heal, yes :P

Regrowth spam would also mean that you lose the healing you would normally get from the regrowth hot ticks due to refreshing the hot all the time.

#34 Guest_Adeiko_*

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 09:20 AM

Is there a tool to model gear besides Lootrank and Rawr? I'm using lootrank extensively and like it plenty, but I'd REALLY like a tool where I can add an array of gear choices to all slots and see what my totals are. Rawr does this, but it's showing incorrect values for haste for me (16.88% form my armory when I've only got 8) and isn't showing ratings at all. Also it errors constantly and I don't like how I have to reconfigure every single socketed item with realistic gems.

I seem to remember even after CTprofiles went down, something else was around during BT that I was using.

Any suggestions?



chardev.org v4 - A World of Warcraft character planner - should work for this

#35 uliko

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 01:28 PM

Would anyone be able to do the math on how much haste you need to get a 1 second cooldown with the different ranks of Gift of the Earthmother?
The math is just way beyond me. Please help this simpleton out :(

http://elitistjerks....17-post110.html

Just replace the 1.3 with however much your GotEM reduces the GCD, for example with 3/5 it would be 1.18 instead. Also thanks for pointing this out, means I can go drop some points from GotEM myself :)

#36 Inara

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 04:58 PM

What do people think about T7 set bonuses? I'm not sure they are really worth going for... especially seeing as how about half of our raid group is on the same token. (We have tons of druids)

#37 Rhaegal

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 05:40 PM

This is purely theoretical, as I don't have the items yet, but I'm okay with them. 5% off Rejuv isn't great, but considering how much more of a role Rejuv plays in my healing than it used to, it's not bad, and will actually have an effect in almost every fight. The bonus healing to Nourish is very situational, and once I have 4T7, I'll most likely at least carry around the pieces to toss on during an extreme tank damage fight like Patchwerk, where rolling Lifebloom and Rejuv will add another 10% to Nourish for getting them topped off. I certainly don't plan to make it a point to keep either bonus to the exclusion of higher general throughput gear, though 2T7 is worth some regen in itself. Specifically:

Rejuv is 18% of base mana, or 3796 * 0.18 = 683 before talents/gear.
Normal: 683.28 * 0.91 (Moonglow) * 0.80 (ToL) = 497 mana
With 2T7: 683.28 * 0.91 (Moonglow) * 0.80 (ToL) * 0.95 (2T7) = 473 mana
Difference: 24 mana
(These numbers seem wrong to me, but I'm at work and can't double check my actual mana cost. Am I missing a talent?)

Equivalent mp5 with rejuv rolled on 1 and 5 targets:
One person: 24 / 3 = 8 mp5
Five people: 24 * 5 / 3 = 40 mp5

In reality, it's worth somewhere between those values depending on the fight, but at least it's a general idea of how much it's worth compared to intellect and spirit, if you're looking at replacing a piece with a similar ilvl but different stat allocation.

[edit] Apparently I can't divide simple numbers in my head. 24 / 3 is not, in fact, 6. :(
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#38 Ruby Moon

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Posted 01 December 2008 - 05:52 PM

What do people think about T7 set bonuses? I'm not sure they are really worth going for... especially seeing as how about half of our raid group is on the same token. (We have tons of druids)

At least to me it looks like getting the off-set pieces is way better due to the fact that their raw stats will overcome the lack of set bonuses, but I'll probably get 2pc because I cast Rejuv a lot; I'll stick to the haste set pieces only.

#39 gemineye42

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Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:50 AM

So wait someone help me break down the healing stats now - are we stacking mp5 instead of spirit? I mean, spirit still adds mp5 AND spellpower, plus affects the tree of life aura. I saw another tree in my guild with a bunch of int and mp5 gems. Is this how I am supposed to gem now? I am so confused!
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#40 Kermit

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Posted 03 December 2008 - 02:37 AM

I've just started to gear up for raiding, with mostly heroic blues and some epic/badge gear. At the moment I'm sitting at about 1000 spirit and 1800 SP in treeform, which works well for me. However in a raid situation it's getting more important to roll spells on multiple people and similar, so I will eventually have to gear more for haste. From what I've seen in naxx loot tables, gear with high spirit is quite rare, and we're getting mediocre spirit + haste instead.

The question is, what kind if spirit is needed to maintain to have a viable manaregen in raids? Will gearing for haste make me have to drop a couple of 100 spi, or should you compensate with spirit gems / pots / food? What's a reasonable amount of spirit or manaregen when raiding?

It would be interesting to know what 25man naxx raiding druid are aiming for in terms of spirit, sp and haste.




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