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Druid roles in EJ


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#21 Chupa

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 07:39 PM

But then again, EJ like most guilds has 8 rogues ready to go at any given point for a raid, a good handful of mages/warlocks, and 2-5 druids at most. While a druid may be able to do solid DPS with a feral or balance build, it's not exactly a unique role that is needing to be filled.

This is exactly why I still have 20 points in Rest. Due to the 1.8 talent changes (and the regen bug doesn't hurt), I feel like I am still healing at the same level I was pre-patch.
So, maintaining approximately the same level of healing while being able to add DPS as needed is where I see my role. I imagine a well-equipped moonkin would be able to participate similarly.


#22 Lord BEEF

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 07:59 PM

Even though it would be near impossible to fit into a high dps feral build, it would be sweet if they would change the sublety talent in restoration to also effect damage in cat form.
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#23 Fromoutofnowhere

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 08:19 PM

Even though it would be near impossible to fit into a high dps feral build, it would be sweet if they would change the sublety talent in restoration to also effect damage in cat form.

Cower works well for me, but I wouldn't mind that suggestion going through and becoming reality.

#24 Kaubel

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 08:38 PM

Cower is utter crap against BWL bosses. Rogues have to use vanish, completely wiping aggro, to avoid getting smeared. We don't have that type of option.

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#25 Chupa

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 08:41 PM

Do we know for sure exactly how much of a deaggro Cower is? If not, I'd like to do some experimenting at some point...

#26 Jol

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 08:44 PM

But then again, EJ like most guilds has 8 rogues ready to go at any given point for a raid, a good handful of mages/warlocks, and 2-5 druids at most. While a druid may be able to do solid DPS with a feral or balance build, it's not exactly a unique role that is needing to be filled.

This is one thing that interests me. Are druids generally delegated to healers because they are limited by their class at performing other roles, or because a disproportionately low number of healers compared to DPS classes results in druids being used to fill that role? Perhaps it's both. However, if it's only the latter, then the solution is more healers, not pigeonholing druids. I think people might neglect the support abilities of the feral and (possibly) balance druid just because of a general lack of healers.

There's also inertia. As has been said before, druids aren't adequately geared for feral, and that is used as a reason to not let them go feral. But they're only not geared because they weren't able to go feral in the first place, or were chastised for rolling on feral gear. And besides gear, there's the mindset that druids are only good at healing, which was generally accepted before 1.8 but has been brought into question since the patch.

#27 Praetorian

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 08:49 PM

Do we know for sure exactly how much of a deaggro Cower is? If not, I'd like to do some experimenting at some point...

A cower is a feint. Literally -- zero difference from the rogue version. For a druid, it removes 600 damage worth of threat, effectively allowing you to do 60 DPS more than you otherwise could if you use it every time it's up.

It's ok, but it doesn't scale, and druids have no passive aggro-reduction (a la rogues, and many mages/warlocks), and no way of wiping aggro entirely (a la rogues and hunters). Aggro is the hard cap on the viability of druid DPS, especially for Horde.

#28 Chupa

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 09:28 PM

So it would likely require keeping a close eye on DM and making sure that I'm not outdamaging the warriors.
Of course, this is off in the distant future, when I CAN outdamage warriors :P

#29 Praetorian

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 09:31 PM

So it would likely require keeping a close eye on DM and making sure that I'm not outdamaging the warriors.
Of course, this is off in the distant future, when I CAN outdamage warriors :P

No, warriors have innate aggro reduction in any non-defensive stance. At any point above 300 DPS, you're generating more aggro than a warrior even cowering every 10 seconds.

#30 Chupa

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 09:57 PM

:(

#31 hamlet_the_lesser

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Posted 26 October 2005 - 10:17 PM

I wish I could do 300 DPS :(. I am luckily to get 200 consistently.
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#32 Graham

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 12:04 AM

Eh, so with that said then what we should be building for is 300DPS with constant cowering and having the equipment to have good mana pool to shift out and heal.

Also, I'm not sure about druids not having a aggro lowering effect in cat. There's a druid in a decent guild who was managing #4 on his MC clear DM (using cower CONSTANTLY) and shifting out to moonfire once whenever out of energy, and he wasn't complaining about stealing aggro.

Is it possible we've missed it?

#33 Lord BEEF

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 12:36 AM

I've also read a few threads on the wow druid forums where people have stated they pulled aggro on vael in cat form even though they did quite a bit less damage than the rogues.

I suppose it's possible that the rogues in question used vanish, but it seems like cat form doesn't have the -20% threat reduction.
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#34 Brown Bread

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 12:41 AM

Vanish makes a huge difference in quick fast dps fights like vael though.

#35 Praetorian

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 12:43 AM

I've also read a few threads on the wow druid forums where people have stated they pulled aggro on vael in cat form even though they did quite a bit less damage than the rogues.

I suppose it's possible that the rogues in question used vanish, but it seems like cat form doesn't have the -20% threat reduction.

Cat form definitely does not.

#36 Spartacus

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 12:58 AM

I CAN"T READ

#37 Cardrian

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 01:29 AM

tl;dr druids innervate me
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#38 Bad Luck

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 02:03 AM

SHADOW WORD: PAIN
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
PRAYER OF HEALING
MIND BLAST
/t Bad Innervate me!

#39 Fjord

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 06:34 AM

I suspect we'll see a lot of respeccing back to heavier healing builds among many classes, including shamans who have gone more intoi Elemental talents lately, once A'Q comes out.

My new elemental spec has 30 points in restoration!


Hey, tonight one of our feral druids almost cracked the top 25 on DM! Actually Chupid did beat me on Flamegor in both damage and healing :huh:

#40 Moiven

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Posted 27 October 2005 - 02:46 PM

SHADOW WORD: PAIN
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
MIND BLAST
PRAYER OF HEALING
MIND BLAST
/t Bad Innervate me!

:D




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