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#41 saibot

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 10:01 AM

The SSO neck no longer works in the most current version, I didn't add support for it in when I rewrote the module.

What you are trying to do is add how much dps you know it does, it is really just easiest to pretend it has that much when comparing. This also one of the new benefits of the new special effect system. Users will be able to manually add there own procs (how much the buff gives, its ICD, its proc rate, etc) and it will automatically compute its value.


Is this scheduled for the 2.2 official release or at a later stage?

#42 Endoscient

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Posted 09 April 2009 - 03:20 PM

Is this scheduled for the 2.2 official release or at a later stage?


Its in the current source code repository, so it will be out whenever the next release (beta or final) is.

#43 HamSlammer

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 06:11 AM

Is the +5% CS damage from the PvP Gloves modeled in b6? I went up and down the 'Misc' menu about 3 times without finding it.

#44 Blutelf

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 10:24 AM

It's in the Equipment Procs menu, and you have to enter it as 0.05. I do not know whether it actually does anything.

#45 Endoscient

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Posted 10 April 2009 - 03:34 PM

Is the +5% CS damage from the PvP Gloves modeled in b6? I went up and down the 'Misc' menu about 3 times without finding it.


It is modeled, but for some reason the gloves in the default itemcache don't have it set already. You can just right click them and refresh from Wowhead/Armory and it will pick it up.

#46 Tyrova

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 08:26 PM

There is a bug in the currently released version that over values the dps gained by setting a higher wait. It will be fixed for next release. The wait feature is more of a model of human error. Say if Judgement is coming off cd .05 sec before Crusader Strike, it is very unlikely we will be able to tell which one is truly coming up first, so we just hit the higher priority one.

Cooldown Count ftw.

I'd also like to say WOOO!!!

#47 Mordekhuul

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Posted 13 April 2009 - 09:28 PM

Cooldown Count ftw.

I'd also like to say WOOO!!!


Even cooldown timers (I use DoTimer) don't seem terribly accurate at the tenths of a second level. I often see one timer list 2 seconds left and another list 1 second left, and then suddenly they both come off cooldown simultaneously. Perhaps that is an artifact of DoTimer and not one seen in other cooldown timers, but it is something I notice often.

#48 Paul

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 01:20 AM

I'm still figuring it all out and I'm about positive I don't have a lot of things configured properly, but I do notice that a lot of the items currently only on PTR (seemingly about to be Live according to MMO-Champ) don't load to PTR when using the "Open in Wowhead" option. They load to the live website and get an error, of course.

Just kind of annoying to manually enter in the PTR stuff.

Also, I keep getting errors when trying to update the item database from Wowhead.

I noticed in this thread you had said something about the Deadly Glad libram being properly assessed in this version, but I had to manually add both it and the Venture Co Libram. Loading from the PTR worked, but for the Venture Co Libram I had to manually change the DS Crit to DS damage, anyway.

Does Rawr load from PTR Wowhead as well as Live or only live when using the Update Item Cache option? It seems like it works when adding items from ptr manually in the item options.

I'm having a little trouble with the new rotation options and was hoping someone could direct me as to how to make it as accurate as possible (or if it's already accurate as it can be).

I'm thinking it's possible rotations could change slightly depending on the set of gear, but can't imagine that it would be too different without being completely in spell damage gear or something. Maybe Libram dependent to some extent?

Regardless of whether I choose Undead or Humanoid/Elemental for the target, Crusader Strike > Judgement > HoW > DS > Exorcism > Consecrate seems to give me the best DPS in Ulduar gear (the ones in the item database at least) with the Deadly Glad Libram of Fortitude. It doesn't seem to matter if either Judgement or HoW comes first.

Also, does the Optimizer change rotations at all?

I don't seem to see a DPS increase with spell crit (Winter's Chill, Moonkin Form, probably Focus Magic, too). Wondering if Exorcism works with melee crit now, instead.

Is there a chance you could add Holy Wrath into the rotation? I rarely work it in, but somewhat often everything but HW is on CD.

And this is probably not the right topic, but I'd prefer to just ask real quick if Avoidance and Mitigation could be separated in the Prot module.

Thanks for making such a great tool, guys!


1st edit: Optimizer is seemingly inable to equip the best set of gear with my current options. The gearset I've found is 6726 DPS in a 5 minute fight with the rotation I said above and .05 wait. Optimizer is only finding a maximum of ~6670.

I noticed you had mentioned something about expertise and hit changes and wondering if that has anything to do with it.

#49 TheBacon

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 09:15 AM

Sorry to ask what probably is a stupid question, but I am going to anyways. If I have a Mac am I just s.o.l. with rawr?

#50 Endoscient

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 12:45 PM

Rawr 2.2 has been released! There has been a lot of cool new stuff in both Retribution and the program overall since the last beta. You can download it over at Codeplex. Since we don't yet know what the official Blizzard talent calculator is going to look like, when importing from the Armory make sure you check your talent spec is accurate.

Rawr 2.2 Changes
  • Totally revamped Special Effect system.
    • Used to model trinket procs, and other similar effects.
    • All WotLK trinkets should be modelled by default.
    • Extremely easy for the user to enter in there own custom effects, and have it accurately modelled.
  • Automatically selected default buffs when loading a character from the Armory.
  • Glyphs moved to being handled as a part of your talent spec.
  • Improved calculations display.
  • A status bar displaying your current dps, so you can always easily see the effects of different changes.
  • Support for using Seal of Command, Rigtheousness and Vengeance.


#51 Endoscient

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 01:22 PM

Sorry to ask what probably is a stupid question, but I am going to anyways. If I have a Mac am I just s.o.l. with rawr?


You can try using mono, but its flaky at best with Rawr. If you have a new Intel mac, your best bet is to dual boot or use a virtual copy of windows (with Parallels or VM Ware Fusion) and run it like that.

#52 Endoscient

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 02:08 PM

I'm still figuring it all out and I'm about positive I don't have a lot of things configured properly, but I do notice that a lot of the items currently only on PTR (seemingly about to be Live according to MMO-Champ) don't load to PTR when using the "Open in Wowhead" option. They load to the live website and get an error, of course.

Just kind of annoying to manually enter in the PTR stuff.

Also, I keep getting errors when trying to update the item database from Wowhead.

I noticed in this thread you had said something about the Deadly Glad libram being properly assessed in this version, but I had to manually add both it and the Venture Co Libram. Loading from the PTR worked, but for the Venture Co Libram I had to manually change the DS Crit to DS damage, anyway.

Does Rawr load from PTR Wowhead as well as Live or only live when using the Update Item Cache option? It seems like it works when adding items from ptr manually in the item options.

I'm having a little trouble with the new rotation options and was hoping someone could direct me as to how to make it as accurate as possible (or if it's already accurate as it can be).

I'm thinking it's possible rotations could change slightly depending on the set of gear, but can't imagine that it would be too different without being completely in spell damage gear or something. Maybe Libram dependent to some extent?

Regardless of whether I choose Undead or Humanoid/Elemental for the target, Crusader Strike > Judgement > HoW > DS > Exorcism > Consecrate seems to give me the best DPS in Ulduar gear (the ones in the item database at least) with the Deadly Glad Libram of Fortitude. It doesn't seem to matter if either Judgement or HoW comes first.

Also, does the Optimizer change rotations at all?

I don't seem to see a DPS increase with spell crit (Winter's Chill, Moonkin Form, probably Focus Magic, too). Wondering if Exorcism works with melee crit now, instead.

Is there a chance you could add Holy Wrath into the rotation? I rarely work it in, but somewhat often everything but HW is on CD.

And this is probably not the right topic, but I'd prefer to just ask real quick if Avoidance and Mitigation could be separated in the Prot module.

Thanks for making such a great tool, guys!


1st edit: Optimizer is seemingly inable to equip the best set of gear with my current options. The gearset I've found is 6726 DPS in a 5 minute fight with the rotation I said above and .05 wait. Optimizer is only finding a maximum of ~6670.

I noticed you had mentioned something about expertise and hit changes and wondering if that has anything to do with it.


Loading item data from PTR Wowhead isn't perfect, but it was mainly a stopgap solution for while the patch was on PTRs, and wasn't fully implemented and tested. The patch is coming out today, so it shouldn't matter anymore anyway.

It is possible for the best rotation to change with gear, which is the reason there is a rotation simulator. No, the optimizer doesn't change the rotation at all. One thing I want to add in the future is to be able to define multiple rotations, and compute how much dps they each do and use the highest one.

If spell crit is having no value, that means you are fighting against a demon/undead mob which your only spell has a 100% crit rate by default.

I do no work on the prot module anymore, so this isn't to place to talk about that. Your best bet would to be to go over to the Rawr Codeplex Discussions.

For the item set you said is higher then the optimizer found, are you sure every item that you are using is marked as available? If so, please post the issue in the main Rawr EJ thread, or over at Codeplex. Remember to ALWAYS include character files when reporting possible issues, we can do MUCH more to help you when you do.

#53 Cavemanz

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 02:48 PM

Holy Wrath dont have a 100% critrate vs undeads/demons afaik. Although I doubt spellcrit on an ability with a 30sec cd is worth gearing for ;p

#54 bulletsux

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 02:58 PM

I just downloaded the new version today, and I found something odd, that the 2pc and 4pc in the buffs tab doesn't check off if you add T8 pieces. On the other hand, using T7, the set bonus boxes are checked. I'm wondering if anyone else is getting this as well?
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#55 Endoscient

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 04:16 PM

I just downloaded the new version today, and I found something odd, that the 2pc and 4pc in the buffs tab doesn't check off if you add T8 pieces. On the other hand, using T7, the set bonus boxes are checked. I'm wondering if anyone else is getting this as well?


For some reason the default item cache included didn't properly set the set names for Tier 8-25. To fix this you will have to edit each of the T8 pieces and in the set name field put in "Aegis Battlegear" instead of "Conqueror's Aegis Battlegear". I will get this fixed for next release.

Holy Wrath dont have a 100% critrate vs undeads/demons afaik. Although I doubt spellcrit on an ability with a 30sec cd is worth gearing for ;p


I was talking about Exorcism. Holy Wrath isn't modeled at all currently, I plan to add this in the future though.

#56 Cavemanz

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 06:00 PM

With my gear, 4pc t7 is currently rated at about 15 dps, while 2pc is rated at 35 dps. Is this correct with the 3.1 changes? I know judgement damage has been nerfed, it just seemed a bit strange that the 2pc would be alot better than 4pc.

#57 Endoscient

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 06:06 PM

With my gear, 4pc t7 is currently rated at about 15 dps, while 2pc is rated at 35 dps. Is this correct with the 3.1 changes? I know judgement damage has been nerfed, it just seemed a bit strange that the 2pc would be alot better than 4pc.


The value of 4t7 varies a lot with what rotation you are using, with our highest dps rotation (with or without 4t7) it doesn't add much. 4 piece doesn't end up adding a lot since a lot of our dps has shifted off of Judgment to other abilities, it was 30-40% and now it is around 10-15% of our dps. A 7 second CD Judgment doesn't fit it well with our other cooldowns, so what you give up to gain the more Judgement time isn't much of an increase.

#58 Paul

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 08:53 PM

I'm having problems loading any module other than the default Night Elf Druid in Bear (just by changing the drop-down menu options, not by loading a profile. I believe armory is down, so that option is out).

EDIT: Finally got in and loaded my profile from b6 of 2.2. Default is now the Retribution module, however loading time and errors during loading still persist.

I tried extracting to the desktop, but my attempts to change the "Read only" option in the folder fail with no error. It just reverts to read only, anyway. Not a check mark, but a filled blue square (Vista x64).

I recall the optimizer having problems with gems when I messed with it last night, but that was b6 of 2.2 I think. This problem has persisted today. I noticed when loading the old profile that none of the normal gems were included in Optimizer, then went through, selecting Bold Dragon's Eye, Bold Stormjewel, Bold Scarlet Ruby, Inscribed Monarch Topaz, Etched Monarch Topaz, and Sovereign Twilight Opal. The optimizer still produced an inferior set, seemingly due to its gem-choices.

It's taking a really long time to load from the old .xml file. Should all my other .xml character files be fine with this new version, as long as I made them in 2.2?

EDIT:

(Not Responding) errors galore while Loading. Continued to get error with loading a saved image even after attempting to extract to program files, desktop, and my documents. Error appears 3-4 times after closing the first window. No idea how to unsave this image and start fresh. I've deleted the previous versions of Rawr I had downloaded, including the zip files.

Guildie friend says it loaded within 30 seconds with no issue on XP.

He hasn't used any previous version of Rawr, however. Thinking it's either an incompatibility with Vista or some kind of artifact saved somewhere on my computer from previous versions. This might explain the problems with "saved image" that I experienced prior.

edit 3: Why is it trying to load information from a "saved image?" How can I delete this saved image and start fresh?

#59 frmorrison

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 09:47 PM

I believe what is happening is Rawr is trying to open an older saved copy of your character (which seems out of date). Try deleting the old versions and start new.

If you don't know where the old versions are located, try searching your computer for Rawr profile file types.

#60 Trakor

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Posted 14 April 2009 - 10:05 PM

I'm having a similar problem as the one Paul is having. I'm also using Vista 64-bit. Last night, I was able to use both the beta 2206b and 2207.

I changed a bit of the setings (gems and gear selection), added 3 or 4 items, changed a couple of trinkets, came up with the best gear setup for my current gear and a possible BiS from Ulduar.

This morning howerver, RAWR would get stuck during start up. The Loading screen would appear and nothing would happen.

I decided to install RAWR again while renaming both the old folder and the old saved files and RAWR was able to start once again (after a very long loading time --> 2 minutes???). So I tried to load my Ulduar BiS set and got an error (because one of the items were added last night, so it wasnt on the new RAWR database. Trying to load my current gear set up did work, but had to wait another 2 minutes or so.

Another thing I've done between last night and this morning was updating WoW, updating some mods and updating my graphic cards drivers/software.




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