Jump to content


Photo

Hunter DPS Analyzer


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
833 replies to this topic

#821 pichuca

pichuca

    Piston Honda

  • Members
  • 110 posts

Posted 26 January 2012 - 10:49 AM

I am very aware of that, yet with your suggestion you could very well end up with ES refunding focus back and AS refunding focus back, on top of your natural focus flow, you end up focus caping.


Another possible scenario is that you use KC hoping for a ToTH procc but it doesn´t happen, and you end either waiting for the last ExS or firing a CoS to regain focus. The only scenerario where I would use KC is when above 85-90 focus. Anyway in that case I would go for ExS-AS-AS-ExS-AS-ExS, delaying the second Explosive shot.
what I don´t know is if delaying it several times may result in a DPS loss.

Asuming a fight like H ultraxion, where you fire 14 BA (the 15 one would occur in the second 360 of the fight at the very least) and you get 14 LnL proccs, you would end delaying ExS for 1 sec 14 times (that is on the very worst case, when you are always very high on focus when LnL proccs) that means you are pushing 2 ExS (and a third of ExS) out of your shot breakdown, and you gain 14 AS + (14 AS - 14KC). Let´s be very forgiving and asume you end up pushing 3 ExS off.

The average explosive shot damage for my character is 56664 per cast.
the average AS is 24682
the average KC is 25592

3 x 56664 = 169992 damage lost when not firing 3 ExS
24682x14 - 25592x14 = -12740 damage lost (KC does less damage but has a higher crit chance)
24682x14 = 345548 damage won from the 14 extra AS

345548 - 12740 - 169992 = 162816 damage won.

This is pretty rough math and I´m sure it can be wrong, but for what it seems, delaying ExS for an extra AS every time this happens is a dps gain over KC. That doesn´t take into account Sic'em proccs and TotH proccs, which would favour AS over KC again.

#822 Goldengiff

Goldengiff

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 82 posts

Posted 09 February 2012 - 08:45 AM

I was looking around at the settings and could not tell if pre-potting is enabled by default or if it's included at all in the sim. Could someone point me in the right direction.

#823 Rivkah

Rivkah

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 838 posts

Posted 09 February 2012 - 05:17 PM

I was looking around at the settings and could not tell if pre-potting is enabled by default or if it's included at all in the sim. Could someone point me in the right direction.


There is no current support for prepotting. I've considered adding it but I'm not sure exactly how many seconds to support it for (since timing on prepotting varies). I'll see if I can make some time this weekend to add it (perhaps 2 seconds off the duration seems appropriate), but keep in mind that it still will only be supported as averaged over the course of the fight.

#824 Goldengiff

Goldengiff

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 82 posts

Posted 09 February 2012 - 06:09 PM

On a patchwerk style fight 1-2 seconds is reasonable. Averaging it over the fight is fine, and honestly probably isn't that big a deal to add since it's a marginal increase, I was just wondering if I had missed the setting.

#825 Gada

Gada

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 44 posts

Posted 10 February 2012 - 09:45 PM

Hi Zenerah,

another thing that came to my mind - i haven't tested it in Simcraft, since im too lame to be able to configure it, but would you be able to reproduce following scenario - since the internal CD on LNL is 10 seconds, and you get a proc of the last tick of it, with your BA coming off cool-down in 2 seconds, you have an 8 second window where you cant get any procs, basically reducing the chance so you virtually waste 4 out of 10 ticks.

Wouldn't it be profitable to wait for lnl to come off CD before reapplying BA in such cases ? There is ofc different scenarios with wasting less ticks, but still its something worth thinking about.

#826 Rivkah

Rivkah

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 838 posts

Posted 11 February 2012 - 07:37 PM

I've added pre-pot support to the site (with a 1 sec reduction in duration for the prepot). Currently it is not enabled by default when you do best raid buffs, but I'm considering adding it to that since on most fights if you'd be bothering to pot you'd probably want to also prepot.

I still need to catch up on some of the other requests I've been getting over the last few weeks- I'll try to do that over the weekend if I can.

Gada, my instinct tells me that at most your suggestion would be at most minimal gain if not a loss (since you do lose the BA tick damage and push back all future BA) and a fairly large amount of micromanagement. There is normally only a 4 second window in which BA is not applied to our target out of every 24 seconds.

The best I can suggest is to setup Simcraft to see if it can reproduce those mechanics. If it turns out to be a noticable gain in Simcraft I'm happy to try to implement it on the site, but complicated rotation mechanics aren't easy to add so I'd rather not do it unless I can see evidence that it would be worthwhile, and Simcraft already has support for the more complex rules that would be needed to simulate this case I believe.

#827 Gada

Gada

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 44 posts

Posted 11 February 2012 - 09:40 PM

I dont think it will be a huge dps loss, even if you delay it by ~8 seconds, which was the maximum i had , getting an extra LnL of the same BA is way more damage than the 4 ticks you would lose, even if they were all crits. Unfortunately i have no idea as to how to reproduce that in Simcraft.

#828 Rivkah

Rivkah

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 838 posts

Posted 11 February 2012 - 11:20 PM

Gada, I have a simple script that simulates LnL frequency, so I modified it to test your theory. I ran it for 60000000 seconds worth of fight time.

With standard behavior (i.e. firing BA on CD):
LnL per min: 2.9999649500006
BA Tick per min: 25.000000583333

With your suggested behavior (delaying BA till the ICD on LnL is up):
LnL per min: 3.0095089498415
Tick per min: 24.324745594588

So basically over an extremely long period of time you gain about .00954 LnL procs per minute and sacrifice about .67525 BA ticks per min. Based on those numbers, I don't see an indication that it'd be worth micromanaging.

#829 Rivkah

Rivkah

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 838 posts

Posted 27 February 2012 - 06:08 AM

I added support for the tricks of the trade to the buff list on the site. This buff will not be enabled by default when enabling best raid buffs (since it's a single target buff), you need to turn it on manually if you want it included in your calculations. I also filed a bug report on the WoW forums since I verified that pets do not inherit the tricks of the trade damage buff from the hunter (unlike the 3% dmg raid buff).

I also updated the default specs as they were pretty out of date.

#830 gexstar

gexstar

    Glass Joe

  • Members
  • 7 posts

Posted 29 February 2012 - 10:53 PM

Hey guys, im kinda wondering if FD considers the T13 4p bonus. Or is it just really weak ?

I have the choice between 397 Morchok Gauntlets and the 384 Set Gloves which would grand me the 4p bonus.
I put it into Femalde Dwarf and it says its a 130 DPS downgrade... does the bunch of agi on the 397 gaunts really outweigh a 30% (!) haste proc for 15 secs ?

Couldnt believe that so i ran it through simcraft... and simcraft said its an increase of about 300 DPS.

I already heard that FD isnt that great for calculating haste values... but thats a kinda large difference between simcraft and FD.

#831 Whitefyst

Whitefyst

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 771 posts

Posted 01 March 2012 - 10:57 PM

Hey guys, im kinda wondering if FD considers the T13 4p bonus. Or is it just really weak ?

I have the choice between 397 Morchok Gauntlets and the 384 Set Gloves which would grand me the 4p bonus.
I put it into Femalde Dwarf and it says its a 130 DPS downgrade... does the bunch of agi on the 397 gaunts really outweigh a 30% (!) haste proc for 15 secs ?

Couldnt believe that so i ran it through simcraft... and simcraft said its an increase of about 300 DPS.

I already heard that FD isnt that great for calculating haste values... but thats a kinda large difference between simcraft and FD.


Actually, of any type of dynamic effect modeled in FD, FD generally handles haste effects the most accurately since it applies the haste over the applicable periods after determining a proc has occurred. If you enable the setting to see debug data, you can clearly see when FD models the T13 4P proc occurring. It is shows as "T13 4pc" in the Notes column of the shot simulation table.

Also in the gear bonuses section, it estimates the benefit of the T13 4pc for your set up. For my hunter as SV, the estimate is +585 DPS.

I already have the T13 4P and the gloves to which you refer (the heroic version in fact). With keeping my 4pc as is and comparing my DPS between the 397 version of the Morchok gloves and the LFR tier gloves I see the following DPS drop of 368, after adjusting my stats via reforging, especially to make up for the large swing in hit rating between the two pieces. Since the DPS difference in the benefit of teh T13 4pc is small between the two cases and both still well over 500 DPS. Thus, for my hunter as SV having the LFR tier gloves to get the T13 4pc is about 175 DPS better than the 397 off-tier gloves.

For MM, the benefit of the T13 4P is even larger as long as you can use that haste proc to fire more AIs instead of ASs.

I do not know much about BM, but I believe that the BM case will see similar results with the 4pc winning.

If you are not getting similar results in FD, I would suggest making sure that you have it set up properly and that you are properly adjusting reforges after gear swaps.

#832 Goldengiff

Goldengiff

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 82 posts

Posted 04 March 2012 - 06:38 PM

Was taking a look at Vial of Shadows on FD and the proc is still listed for the pre-patch damage. Wondering if it's been updated.

#833 Rivkah

Rivkah

    Great Tiger

  • Members
  • 838 posts

Posted 04 March 2012 - 08:07 PM

Was taking a look at Vial of Shadows on FD and the proc is still listed for the pre-patch damage. Wondering if it's been updated.


I don't actually have the trinket so I can't test it myself, and I've not had much luck finding the updated data on it (i.e. the new ICD and if the AP scaling has changed). If you know what it is I can update. Since they had said they were trying to keep the total damage the same but just changing the frequency of proc I'm assuming the current calculations aren't far off, but obviously it'd be better to update it if I can get those values.

#834 Goldengiff

Goldengiff

    Von Kaiser

  • Members
  • 82 posts

Posted 21 March 2012 - 07:05 PM

A lot of hunters have been using rotating pets on heroic spine for burn phases on the tendon. Would it be possible with the current site mechanics to model rotating ferocity pets to gain more Call of the Wilds?

If you have 4 ferocity pets you could have 1 CotW every minute, at the cost of 3sec of not dpsing to switch pets. It may not be worth the headache of coding it all out to see if it's a dps increase but I figure it can't hurt to ask.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users