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Off Spec Healers - 60-70


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#21 Drolz

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 01:21 PM

Druids have problems main healing in many higher end TBC 5 mans regardless of spec. The lack of fast heals leads to a lot of deaths that could have been prevented by another healing class. Obviously this is something that can be mitigated by skill, but I've found paladins and priests to be considerably more effective main healers in virtually every situation.

#22 Janvier

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 01:53 PM

Thanks for all of the great replies.

My feel my spec should at least have Swiftmend, it has saved myself and my group more times than I can count. I was considering putting my other points into Balance. I have a decent amount of balance gear, some from pre TBC and some I picked up while in the TBC. Plus I think it would be fun.

Is anyone running with a Balance/Resto Build? Where the Resto tree gives you at least Swiftmend?

#23 Farstrider

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 02:30 PM

Thanks for all of the great replies.

My feel my spec should at least have Swiftmend, it has saved myself and my group more times than I can count. I was considering putting my other points into Balance. I have a decent amount of balance gear, some from pre TBC and some I picked up while in the TBC. Plus I think it would be fun.

I was in exactly the same spot as you. I was 0/0/51 heading into TBC, and I thought I'd try and run with that. I found exactly the same as you, i.e. It was absolutely brain-numbing. I respecced to 0/20/31 at first, as I didn't (again like you) want to give up swiftmend. In the end another druid I know told me to bite the bullet and give it up, so I went to 0/30/21, and am now 0/33/21 at level 63. So far, and take this with a pinch of salt as I've only solo-healed Hellfire Citadel and Coilfang instances, I've been fine. Heart of the Wild made a massive difference to how long I could heal for.

Some have gone for 0/41/10 but I simply couldn't give up Nature's Swiftness - it's an absolute boon both for instancing and for solo work, and those "oh-shit" moments when you accidentally pull adds to yourself while questing.

I will head towards 70 aiming to end up 0/40/21, and then probably ultimately respec to 0/30/31 for the best of both worlds. Finally, like you, as I've got more +spell dmg gear it's been tempting to try something like 17/13/21 but what I've done instead is create a sort of hybrid +heal/+dmg gear set that allows me to chuck moonfires & starfires on early pulls, while still keeping +500 odd healing.

Hope that helps.
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#24 Zelionaya

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 02:41 PM

Thanks for all of the great replies.

My feel my spec should at least have Swiftmend, it has saved myself and my group more times than I can count. I was considering putting my other points into Balance. I have a decent amount of balance gear, some from pre TBC and some I picked up while in the TBC. Plus I think it would be fun.

Is anyone running with a Balance/Resto Build? Where the Resto tree gives you at least Swiftmend?

I'm running with a resto/balance spec now. I was full feral for a long time before BC and kept that spec to level to 70. I was comfortable main-healing everything up to 70. I did warn my groups that I didn't have instant heals and they should watch the aggro, and I drank pots here and there, but I didn't have any major problems. The first time I really felt stretched was main healing Shattered Halls. The large pulls meant a lot of party damage, my HOT's weren't that strong and I just didn't have the regen or quick heals I needed.

I recently respecced 27/0/34. I've found this a really efficient and strong healing spec - I use lifebloom a lot for touch up party healing, and I have strong healing touches for use on tanks. Swiftmend has also come in very handy in a lot of situations.

It's taken some getting used to but it's still possible to solo with decent efficiency, I just feel a lot more fragile than I did as feral. I do like the synergy between the balance and resto trees, and that it's easy to put together a nice off-healing/caster damage set for times when I go somewhere as a secondary healer. So if you're thinking you want strong heals while still being able to solo effectively, the balance/resto hybrid could be a good compromise.

#25 Guest_Ahindwe_*

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 02:57 PM

The leveling instances really shouldn't give you much trouble if you're healing with an off-spec, assuming your team is at the suggested level. I've leveled as an enhancement shaman, and called upon to heal (solo at times) and haven't had much trouble. The level 70 instances (particularly Arcatraz, Botanica and Shattered Halls come to mind) will probably give you trouble (or at least be quite challenging) without one player with a healing spec. I'd definitely recommend putting a solid 30 points (at least) into feral or balance, and drop your remaining points into restoration; leveling is far more fun when you can grind efficiently.

#26 caitlin

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Posted 07 February 2007 - 03:04 PM

A lot depends on your group. At 49/0/12 (druid), you can't be the healer that keeps a bad group rockin', but you can definitely keep a decent party up. Haven't tried Heroics yet, but was only healer in basically every instance, and it's definitely manageable. Main problem is dealing with damage scattered through the entire party: a Tranq. every 10th minute aside, there's really no way to deal with collateral damage quickly. If the party can survive long enough, HoTs take care of this, but quick bursts on everyone is a nightmare - so I advise everyone to drink healing pots and use bandages during such fights, and take extra care to avoid eating unneccessary damage.

Mana potions are a must for places like Black Morass - but normally I drink 2-3 there only, mostly during the bossfights. Guess it's the same for PvE healer specced folks though, I've yet to do an instance where I didn't have to Innervate the main healer at least once.

#27 Guest_Amun_*

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 07:04 AM

I am a 0/44/17 druid, and I main healed an arcatraz run that did not wipe. I have cooking and fishing, so I was munching on fishsticks the whole run, but it was as smooth an arcatraz run I have seen. Hardest parts were the Fire Demon boss and the infernal trash. Stupid meteor. As long as you have a good tank, anybody can heal a run if most of the incoming damage is focused on 1 person.

Edit: My guild never did much outside BWL and leather healing itemization is kinda meh in the level 70 instances but I still have over 1000+heal. My healing set has 2 pieces of the priest set in it, I wish there was a leather equivalent other then crappy moonglade.

#28 crimsonsentinel

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 08:07 AM

As a shadow priest who's primarily focused and gearing as dps, my heal gear is lacking and the only healing talent I can say I have is silent resolve and meditation. I find that there are very few end game instances I can solo heal (especially since our guild has only 1 level 70 mage and very few of our rogues have imp sap so we're sol on humanoid CC's), but with 2 healers its cake.

#29 Mearis

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 09:23 AM

As a shadow priest with good healing gear (around 1200 healing) I have absolutely no problem main healing any instance on non-heroic solo. I have a relatively gimped shadow spec though, as I am running around with 0/18/43 since I did want to retain some healing throughput.

#30 Babe Bridou

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 10:14 AM

I've decided to go the "best of both worlds" way. I've done all the levelling as holy, using a balanced healing/nuking/pvp healing/solo nuking build.

23 disc for imp divine spirit
33 holy for blessed resilience, full spirit guidance, surge of light, improved prayers, spirit of redemption et al.
5 shadow for full spirit tap

Shadow word: death and holy fire hit+dot give me plenty of spirit tap procs in instances, including a majority of boss fights. I can solo with about 550 damage and healing, heal with about 900 +heal, and whenever spirit tap procs I basically enter some kind of "god mode", whether it's damage dealing or healing or mana regeneration. Think "four digits spirit for 15 seconds".

I've had no troubles healing in karazhan with this build, but I've yet to test heroics.

#31 Chuck

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 10:42 AM

I gotta say we're quite blessed in our guild. Out of the 4 druids we have in our base raiding team 3 want to spec ToL, me not beeing one of them.

Tree of Life owns - put one in MT group and your healers will love you. The downside on this is definately that the druid has a really hard time farming money outside so 2 of the ToL druids are still waiting until they finished every single quest ingame. However back to the topic: I'm 0/30/31 (like to call that heavy resto if I get asked to heal) so imho I get to play all my cards in instances. I hit 40k tankpoints selfbuffed, I'm able to keep up with DPS pretty ok as long I can behind a mob and I don't feel my healing nerfed at all as I'm gathering mana regen gear like mad.
In my opinion this is the way druids were meant to be, jumping into every situation when needed and helping out, getting instance spots offered like mad be it as tank or healer (not as pure dps ofc)

To make a long story short: yes you can heal all non heroic instances with a hybrid spec like that. All pre 70 instances are pretty easy so don't worry too much. Once you hit 70 you have all choices open. You could go full feral/oomkin to be DPS/tank, full healing to be mainhealer in any (non heroic) instance or a good balanced hybrid spec and fullfil all roles good enough.
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#32 Kallisti

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 10:46 AM

Balance/Resto Druid here.

I'm currently specced 40/0/21. My first plan was to go for 34/0/27, but i found the additional resto talents not required and prefered the dmg talents to quest and lvl.

This was planned as a spec just to play to 70 (starting with 30/0/21, Moonkin at 61, then Dreamstate till 64), but i am more than pleased with the possibilities it offers to me.

Some words to my equip and history: When I went through the Dark Portal, i was equipped with the best possible T2 equip (Reju Gem, Shard of the Scale, Rampant Growth). We had the Twins down and 5 bosses in Naxx, but our server is too new and we were not in a hurry to make more progression pre tbc. My dmg equip only consisted of the Skeram pants, BWL gloves and Aq20/5 man crap. ~200 Spelldmg... Now only 3 T2 items are left (due to the 20mp5 bonus), and the moonkin equip has almost 600 spelldmg + trinkets and some hit and crit. Including the spec i am at 1300+ Heal (1100 on items) and a manareg of ~360/200 due to charscreen (~105 mp5 on items, Dreamstate).

I have healed through every 5 man instance solo and it was not really a problem. Been full resto since my first day in Molten Core on this server, i miss some resto talents and especially the swiftmend I learned to love. On the other hand, i rarely use Rejuvenation anymore. Only on tanks and not that much. My primary healing spells have moved from HT 4+7 to Lifebloom und HT Max + 8-10. Lifebloom is amazing. So mana efficient, quick and the spell that i use to heal everything but the mt. For some bosses it is required to spam max rank HT, regrowth and even throw in a Nature's Swiftness max HT and if the whole group takes much dmg (1st Shattered Hall Boss Enrage Whirl is a wonderful example), Barkskin and Tranquility are just incredible.

Mostly we still went with another hybrid as backup healer, 70% of the time a retri paladin, 30% a shadow priest. That's a huge help of course but in non-heroics, it's not necessary.

What i did not expect and what really satisfies me is the fact that i can be on par with mage dps when it is not about aoe. Of course i have to be more active than them and can not just play "1 button", you have to keep your dots ticking, use wrath and starfire depending on the situation, dont forget the cooldown of your dmg trinkets and play on the edge of aggro (which aint that bad in non heroics if it is too much since you got some armor, but you should of course avoid it). But if I do that, I'm exactly on the same level as our Mages and Warlocks (speaking about the best players of those classes that i know). If you now subtract the ~5% dmg they did by my aura (well the crit bonus is less than 5 but since some talents proc of crits, it should be okay) and add it to me, i did even more. If i shift out and heal if it's dangerous, i fall behind of course, but who cares, when it keeps the group alive?

With a balance/resto spec you CAN do decent dmg as long as the gear progression equals the other classes. You CAN mainheal every 5 man instance. You CAN mainheal heroics but it requires a backup healer in some situations (only did ramparts and slave pens so far, maybe the spec comes to it's limit in the further instances, i'll have to see that). You CAN play a true hybrid and have a very broad spectrum of spells and actions.

I miss my full resto capabilities. I miss Swiftmend, I miss zero-aggro-tranquility, I miss extremly strong hots, I miss 20% healaggro reduce instead of 8% and I miss some HT power.

But i think that's a 10-20% healing advantage (since Moonglow, Lunar Guidance, Nature's Grace and Dreamstate are pretty strong healing talents too) I am giving up. But these 10-20% less healing allow me to deal 100-300% more damage. I will keep this spec until i finished every outland quest and until this happens, i'll have to collect more experiences in other heroics and raids to see if my spec is viable there. If i can still fullfill my duties and make it worth for the raid to pick me instead of a mage or a priest, i'll stay hybrid. If raiding will require me to spec full resto, i will do that immediately after finishing the last quest. I want to be an enrichment for my group and my raid and not a weight.

If the game mechanics allow me to achieve that as a true hybrid, dreams come true. :-) So far, it's fine.
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#33 Zephro

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 01:11 PM

Just chiming in to agree with everyone else. My healing gear is atrocious (~9000 mana at level 70, and around +660 healing) and my resto talents only go down as 3/3 Imp Rejuv.

I healed a Sethekk Halls run last night using 80% hots and never had to stop to drink once. You'll be fine. When you see how fast you solo as feral, you'll kick yourself for not respeccing earlier.

#34 Miriam

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 01:57 PM

I levelled to 70 with a full feral spec, and it was great. Getting some 400-800 dps regularly when soloing was pretty nice. And I spent like 95% of my time solo, so it was obviously the way to go. I had the opportunity to do instances as a tank, dps (with amazingly good dps output btw, even though I'm not very good at it) and healer as well. Solo healing the levelling instances with full feral spec was challenging, but not a major problem. However, you definately need both gear and skills in order to compensate the loss in talents. With 900+ healing (almost entirely my "old" level 60 epics, there isn't that many healing updates) I was able to keep the party up, but it was sometimes quite tricky and I ended up being oom at the end of many boss fights.

Last instance that I did as full feral and only healer was Steamvault. We had a good party, didn't wipe either, but I just felt like I was too much on the limit too often. Seeing that the other 70 instances are definately harder than Steamvault, I specced to a sort of "healer/tank" spec with 31 resto, 30 feral. Most groups need either a tank or healer anyway, so this spec should cover for both with a 90%+ efficiency. Plus I'm still able to do questing in a reasonable way, though I do miss mangle a lot. I don't see it so much as a hybrid spec like many people seem to do, it's definately a "role-switcher" spec for 5-mans.

#35 Lord BEEF

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 03:33 PM

It's a bit better than I thought. With the addition of lifebloom we now have a lot of ways to anticipate damage so that our lower throughput isn't as big of a deal.

On the other hand, my 400ish ticks of rejuv are pathetic compared to the 664 renew ticks of the holy priest I groupped with.
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#36 fuzzy

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 05:12 PM

As a 14/0/44 priest I'm finding that I "can" solo heal pretty much all 5-mans, but I'll be drinking quite a bit. Morass is tough though, best to have 2 off specs or 1 heal spec.

I will admit though, that I'm about to trash all my T2-3. I'd just rather pass on the morass/arc/bot/mech groups if they are wanting a heal spec healer. Shadow priests just add way more to a group with a heal spec healer than they add to a group by solo-healing or even healing with another off-spec (which is 2nd best though!)

Good example, I grouped up to clear out bot. We had a heal spec shaman who was quite well spec'd and a great healer. At first I was dps'ing out of shadow form to toss out the occassional mend/flash/renew/gheal. When we hit the end boss, we found that we couldn't kill him with me in healform. The second I switched to full dps/assist-add-killing the boss was trivial. And that boss is, in my opinion, one of the hardest of the TK bosses.

#37 Vykromond

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 08:28 PM

I solo healed Shattered Halls at 68 with a 0/4x/14 build last night (druid). Wasn't even too hard. Potted on Kargath, otherwise didn't need to.

#38 Janvier

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Posted 12 February 2007 - 06:18 PM

In case anyone cares..............

I finally respec'd last night (at lvl 65). My new spec is something like 21/0/34.

The resto tree has all of the attributes that I felt were important for me, NS, Swiftmend I also took the talent that gives 3% crit to all spells. The other talents were pretty straight forward, improved rejuv etc.

In balance I focused on crit chance and crit bonus, with so few points to spend here that was easy.

What a difference..............................

I did some questing last night in the marsh. I have about +320dmg gear and 17% crit chance (so not great at the the moment but I know it will improve). My Starfire's were criting for 2k, Moonfire crit for 800, Wrath crit for 1k and the crits were often. It made taking down mobs a hell of a lot easier easier, but I still feel that I kept all of my must have healing talents to be a very effective primary healer in instances.

Thanks for all the input.

#39 RK

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Posted 19 February 2007 - 11:32 PM

Good example, I grouped up to clear out bot. We had a heal spec shaman who was quite well spec'd and a great healer. At first I was dps'ing out of shadow form to toss out the occassional mend/flash/renew/gheal. When we hit the end boss, we found that we couldn't kill him with me in healform. The second I switched to full dps/assist-add-killing the boss was trivial. And that boss is, in my opinion, one of the hardest of the TK bosses.


The one consistent point in Blizzard's encounter design is "DPS is king", and I can't see that changing. Fights which can be made easily stable by stacking healers and slowly DPSing down are too simple for them at this point.

It seems like the ideal 5-man setup on about 90% of 5-man fights is one main healer and one off-spec who can cover burst damage events, main healer being MC'd, feared, forced to run away from fire elementals, etc. but also DPS the rest of the time.

#40 fuzzy

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Posted 20 February 2007 - 07:14 PM

The one consistent point in Blizzard's encounter design is "DPS is king", and I can't see that changing. Fights which can be made easily stable by stacking healers and slowly DPSing down are too simple for them at this point.

It seems like the ideal 5-man setup on about 90% of 5-man fights is one main healer and one off-spec who can cover burst damage events, main healer being MC'd, feared, forced to run away from fire elementals, etc. but also DPS the rest of the time.

Agreed. I (shadow priest) finally got around to a heroic underbog last night and had to step out of shadowform 2x, on those 2 pimped bog giants. Other than that the holy priest was fine healing everything else. Also who would have thought mind control could is now a legitimate spell? Holy hell, it makes many heroic's much easier (bring hit gear). A few pulls I had an oracle and the other priest had a healer, it was quite fun!

Another incorrect assumption that folks tend to think is that shadow priests can't spike. We can spike to around 700-900 dps with a swd/mb/mf/mf twist, you do need about +800 dam gear though. I wouldn't recommend that in PVP obviously, but it's fine in PVE and a good way to get Mend back on someone important since SWD triggers the heal. It does drive your other healers insane though. Wait this is a "heal" thread, nvm.




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